Talk:Aztlán

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 12 August 2020 and 4 December 2020. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): KMag11.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 15:08, 16 January 2022 (UTC)

Hello Wikipedia community, I am a student in a Wikipedia educational course and would desire to edit parts of this article. I feel as though this article can use some expansion on the 'us by the chicano movement' sections. I would like to add how this myth has been used to unite Mexican-Americans in this identity. I also would just want to add a few more sentences to the 'places postulated by Aztlán' section. The source I am using can give some more insight on this area of the topic. The source I will be using to make my edits is titled 'Aztlán: Essays on the Chicano Homeland' and it is edited by Rudolfo Anaya, Francisco A. Lomelí, and Enrique R. Lamadrid. The most recent version of this source comes from 2017, so I think it is pretty reliable. If any of the community members have any suggestions grievances or to my potential edits I will be glad to hear them. S4mon (talk) 04:50, 4 May 2023 (UTC)

Location of Aztlán

At the Aztec Exhibition at London's Royal Academy of Art, a couple of years ago, Aztlán was described as being 'an island to the east.' —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.100.250.208 (talk • contribs) October 23, 2006 (UTC)

I've heard this mentioned often, but I've never found substantial evidence of it. Does anyone have confirmation that Aztlán was thought of as an island in the east? --Izzly (talk) 16:33, 1 June 2009 (UTC)

It very clearly and emphatically was not thought to be that. This is just confusing Plato and Aztec myth because of what is perceived to be similar sounds. ·Maunus·ƛ· 16:49, 1 June 2009 (UTC)

I enjoyed reading this article and making my evaluations on the topic. Very interesting. Arivenelle mckenzie (talk) 01:57, 26 January 2020 (UTC)

I would like to know more about how the Aztlán people work. Arivenelle mckenzie (talk) 01:59, 26 January 2020 (UTC)

Aztlan Location

What do you mean by an island to the east? East as in Japan, or east as some island in the Caribbean (east of Mexico)? The reason why I say Japan is that they found human remains in Hokkaido of 10,000 years ago (BCE) and the DNA of a few of the human remains was D-1 Haplogroup (which also has been traced to Mongolia, Siberia) which is the same DNA genetic markers that many of the Aztec human remains have. If Aztlan is Hokkaido, Japan, then that would make sense for we have genetic proof to do the matches. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.245.105.217 (talk) 02:21, 20 February 2014 (UTC)

Aztlān

I think the page for Aztlán should be divided to separate the mythical and/or historic city of Aztlān from the Chicano Youth Movement topics. I think perhaps a separate Aztlán (Political_Movement) page would be in order. Also it would seem prudent to rename the page as Aztlān in keeping with the Nahuatl language. Stormcellardoor (talk) 19:50, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Well, agree about the separate page and (partially) object to renaming the page into Nahuatl.

I can't speak for usage within Mexico, but in the US the political meaning is much more prevalent; however, its original idea seems to have been to reference that America really was a homeland and homecoming for Chicanos and not a place of exile. So it is somewhat appropriate to discuss it all together on the same page; although if so the page should be reworked to include more context for the modern political idea both among the Chicano movement & among anti-illegal immigrant groups.

If there is a separate page, it would make sense to have Aztlan (Aztec) simply be Aztlān and Aztlan (US) be Aztlán with Aztlan as a disambig between them & other uses (such as the journal.) However, if it stays one page, the most appropriate modern use is from the Spanish, I'd think. -LlywelynII (talk) 18:16, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

--Aztlan-- There are some resources connecting the Aztlan origin to Egypt as evident in the discoveries of Egyptian artifacts and underground dwellings found in the United States, mainly Illinois, Burrow tunnels and Colorado's, Grand Canyons — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.22.58.14 (talk) 13:52, 29 March 2013 (UTC)

Orphaned references in Aztlán

I check pages listed in Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for orphaned references in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of Aztlán's orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for this article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.

Reference named "WashingtonTimes":

• From Reconquista (Mexico): "Mexican aliens seek to retake 'stolen' land". The Washington Times. 16 April 2006. Retrieved 14 February 2013.
• From José Ángel Gutiérrez: Mexican aliens seek to retake 'stolen' land, Washington Times, April 16, 2006.

I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not. AnomieBOT⚡ 07:50, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

 Done checked and what's currently present looks good... Boogerpatrol (talk) 03:15, 10 November 2013 (UTC)

Was La Raza removed from Groups that advocate Aztlan?

I'm pretty sure it was included previously, and I don't see any notes that it was removed. I notice the list has changed and the Marx-Lenin group was added. 74.60.161.158 (talk) 18:41, 27 May 2015 (UTC)

External links modified

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I have just modified 3 external links on Aztlán. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20060103021137/http://www.arqueomex.com:80/S2N3nAZTLAN67.html to http://www.arqueomex.com/S2N3nAZTLAN67.html
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080414025315/http://www2.nau.edu/~gender-p/Papers/Vollemarapdf.pdf to http://www2.nau.edu/~gender-p/Papers/Vollemarapdf.pdf
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20060429215406/http://www.csuchico.edu:80/art/contrapposto/contrapposto01/242a/sanderson.html to http://www.csuchico.edu/art/contrapposto/contrapposto01/242a/sanderson.html

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External links modified

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I have just modified 3 external links on Aztlán. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20121107032413/http://www.aztlan.net/homeland.htm to http://www.aztlan.net/homeland.htm
• Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.arqueomex.com/S2N3nAZTLAN67.html
• Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.csuchico.edu/art/contrapposto/contrapposto01/242a/sanderson.html

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Inclusion of Neo-Nazi Author?

I noticed that neo-Nazi author Harold Covington's work is referenced in the "In Literature" section of this page. When I found it, his name was spelled wrong so the link didn't work. I fixed the link, and made it clear that he's a Nazi. However, I'm wondering if we shouldn't just remove the bullet point entirely. On the one hand, it's true and notable information (assuming that there really is a nation called Aztlán in his books- I haven't read them and don't really want to look them up). On the other, I generally feel like it's good practice to minimize Nazis' visibility online. Additionally, the edit was originally made by 23.111.165.2, an IP address that's since been blocked for edits that ranged from non-constructive to racially crude to harassment. Thoughts?

Aquaticonions (talk) 17:13, 5 May 2020 (UTC)

I think you answered you question. If its notable, then there really isn't any reason to omit it. Garuda28 (talk) 17:16, 5 May 2020 (UTC)

But it isn't.·maunus · snunɐɯ· 20:12, 5 May 2020 (UTC)

Please don't apply policies about American articles over foreign articles. Difuarti (talk) 00:10, 5 October 2024 (UTC)

SN 1054 Crab Nebula

If this is true, then there should be links to the SN1054 section of Crab Nebula page, and a link back. This would add to Japanese and Chinese observations. But only if it is true. — Preceding unsigned comment added by ThomasHarrisGrantsPass (talk • contribs) 03:31, 2 October 2021 (UTC)

Is true; please check references. Difuarti (talk) 00:08, 5 October 2024 (UTC).

Wiki Education assignment: Migration in World History

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 31 January 2023 and 19 May 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): S4mon (article contribs).

— Assignment last updated by S4mon (talk) 20:05, 8 May 2023 (UTC)

Etymology copyedit dispute

This seems to be the disputed sentence (from Aztlán#Etymology): Although it is not possible under Astatlan Nahuatl morphological form is possible that the Nahuatl word was borrowed in an hispanicization case due is very similar to the Spanish words hasta, "until" or "up to" and tan, "so" or "as" and Astatlan Nahuatl word was possibly converted during Crónica Mexicáyotl writing process monitored by colonial Spanish authorities to Aztlán Hispanicized word. The sentence clearly contains a number of grammatical errors that make it difficult to interpret, so Dan Harkless has a legitimate complaint.

This would be my interpretation of the sentence: Although the morphological form Astatlan is not possible in Nahuatl, it is possible that the Nahuatl word was borrowed in a case of Hispanicization due to it being very similar to the Spanish words hasta, "until" or "up to", and tan, "so" or "as". The Nahuatl word Astatlan may have been converted to the the Hispanicized word Aztlán during the process of writing Crónica Mexicáyotl, which was monitored by Spanish colonial authorities. Is that correct? Note that there remains a contradiction: the first part says Astatlan is not a Nahuatl word, and the bit immediately after that says "the Nahuatl word was borrowed" – which Nahuatl word? The last part (which I turned into a separate sentence) even talks about "the Nahuatl word Astatlan".

Furthermore, the sentence appears to lack an inline citation. Does one of the later citations apply to it or is this speculation a case of original research? The disputed sentence, without references, was added by Difuarti between two sentences that already had references. Un assiolo (talk) 10:50, 5 September 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for confirming I'm not the one being unreasonable here. Your assessments all seem valid. --Dan Harkless (talk) 14:17, 5 September 2024 (UTC)

@Un assiolo: show the part that says Astatlan is not a Nahuatl word. --Difuarti (talk) 23:50, 5 September 2024 (UTC)

I think @Un assiolo's misunderstanding shows that the sentence is difficult to understand. My understanding of your sentence with the help of this chat, Wiktionary, and some basic Nahuatl knowledge is:

1. Astatlān is a Nahuatl word meaning "place of egrets"

2. The "it" that "isn't possible" in your sentence is the word "Aztlán"

3. The borrowed Nahuatl word is "Astatlān"

4. Your sentence reads like Astatlan Nahuatl is a special dialect, but I don't believe that's what you meant to convey.

5. I concur with Un Assiolo's interpretation of the Hispanicization of Astatlān, but it is difficult to parse from your sentence.

I love linguistics so I think this is a pretty fascinating topic, but I think Un Assiolo makes a good point about citations. Without a source, you'll probably find your edit reverted due to WP:NOR. It might be a fun topic to discuss in Wiktionary's etymology scriptorium: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Wiktionary:Etymology_scriptorium Cryptoisomorph (talk) 02:56, 6 September 2024 (UTC)

I took Although it is not possible under Astatlan Nahuatl morphological form to mean that Astatlan is not a possible morphological form (i.e. word) in Nahuatl. I see my interpretation was incorrect. I did my best, but the sentence is incoherent.

You also haven't responded to the question regarding references. What is your source for the claim you added? Every claim has to have a source. If you came up with the hypothesis yourself, that is original research, which is not allowed on Wikipedia. --Un assiolo (talk) 15:11, 6 September 2024 (UTC)

As no source has been provided, I have opted to revert the Etymology section to what it was before the addition. If a source is provided, the information can be added back, and we can then discuss the phrasing. --Un assiolo (talk) 17:09, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

Please do not use misleading edit summaries to remove talk page sections or article tags. -- LCU ActivelyDisinterested «@» °∆t° 20:28, 6 October 2024 (UTC)

I see that a few days after I removed the possibly unsourced content, User:Difuarti restored it, with the edit summary saying "sourced content removal". Difuarti did not answer my question as to whether the content is indeed backed by the sources listed. I would assume not, since the sources were already present before Difuarti's additions. Difuarti also keeps removing the tags saying the text is incoherent, which everyone here agrees it is. Difuarti, please say explicitly whether the sources listed support the speculative-sounding additions. Since you presumably have access to the source, can you provide a quotation to support the claims? (I apologize for taking so long to respond.) --Un assiolo (talk) 13:56, 19 October 2024 (UTC)