Talk:Nintendo DS/Archive 4

Conflicting Pricing Dates

In the Marketing section one paragraph sais the US price was dropped from $149.99 to $129.99 in August. then in the prcing history section below that it sais the price was dropped in November. Neither section has sources. What is the best way to confirm one way or the other? --Scyth02 16:42, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

November of 2005... What was happening then? Ah yes, Mario Kart DS was released, and everyone was anticipating the arrival of Nintendo Wi-Fi Connection. I know the DS was $129.99 before all that hype occurred, so I am fairly certain that the August price change would be correct. Unfortunately, I'm not sure how exactly to confirm that. --Edit: Silly me. All I had to do was type in "Nintendo DS price drop August 2006" into Google and I was able to find several links, such as this one. I will fix that immediately. --Beboppin 11 January 2007

Overlinking - work needed

There's far too many repeated links in the article (see Wikipedia:Manual of Style (links)). I've started a tidyup operation, but I could use some help. --Oscarthecat 01:29, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

there's no such thing as overlinking, silly! =P —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 70.237.109.52 (talk • contribs) .

Yes there is. Koweja 00:29, November 14 2006 (UTC)

Technology part should be the specs part.

The Technology part of the article should be called renamed to specs and organized a littly bit. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Spareus151 (talk • contribs) .

Edition

"with the possibility of [download stations in] Wal-Mart and Target being added later"

There ARE Download Stations in Wal-Mart and Target, and the numbers are growing. I think that this should be fixed. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by WiiVolve (talk • contribs) .

Nintendo DS Lite

The original DS is no longer supported by Nintendo, nor is it sold any longer. I think the page should be converted to DS Lite specs, and images. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by YSHOULDUKNOW123 (talk • contribs) .

There's already a DS Lite page. This one is for the original DS. Ex-Nintendo Employee 13:00, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

nintendo no longer supports the NES so it should be converted to wii specs. it doesnt really work like that. there should be a link to it at the top though. -- Numberwang 14:06, 28 April 2007 (UTC)

I think that the picture at the top of the page (which is currently the old DS) should be placed side-by-side with a picture of the DS Lite, for instant comparison. What do you guys think of this?
-dogman15 04:01, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

As was stated above, there's already a DS Lite page. This one is for the original DS. There is no need to excessively put information about the Lite here, the same way that there is no need to put a picture of a Game Boy Color onto the Game Boy page. Ex-Nintendo Employee 05:00, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

I would like to note that a GameBoy and GameBoy color are VASTLY different technologically, while a DS Lite is essentially a variant upon the original DS. It's more like, say, a GameBoy Pocket compared to the original GameBoy, or a GameBoy Advance SP compared to an original GameBoy Advance. And I personally would like to see the GameBoy Pocket and GBA SP with their respective counterparts. MasterXiam 23:03, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

The original Nintendo DS is obesolete. Nintendo doesn't make it any more. Why not put up a picture of the Nintendo DS Lite up instead of the picture of the original Nintendo DS? We changed the image on the PS2 page to show the PS2 redesigned...we need to change this article to reflect the DS Lite more. Knowitall 16:56, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Is "obesolete" meant to be a pun? Unlike the slim PS2, we have a whole separate article for the DS Lite, and while this article provides some overall coverage for the DS platform, it is also the main article for the original device. I think that just as with the Game Boy, readers will be able to find the model they were looking for just fine with the current scheme. Dancter 20:23, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

The original DS is still available in stores and from Nintendo directly. It's not completely dead yet. Tim 17:56, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

I still think we should at least add an image of the DS Lite below the image of the DS 'fat'. Knowitall 20:52, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

There's a spurious 'It has been replaced by the Nintendo DS Lite' at the end of the third paragraph, even lacking the full stop and making no sense whatsoever in that place. Unfinished edit maybe? If so, someone registered nerf it? 213.162.65.17 10:18, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

E3 04 pics

I think we need some pictures of the DS as it was at E3 2004. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Seloth (talk • contribs) .

There was one, but was a copyvio. -- ReyBrujo 01:43, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

Size comparison

The pic [1] recently posted into the article doesn't seem to convey the size of the two units correctly, if I look at [2]. The ubergizmo pic shows the DS reaching the outside of the PSP's "shoulder" buttons. Is one of them incorrect? --Oscarthecat 17:45, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

The previous image, Image:PSP and DS.jpg, was a real life comparison. The new one, Image:DS compared to PSP.PNG, is an artistic representation. I had reverted it to the previous one, but the author of the artistic representation reverted back. I agree that it is not accurate, and should be replaced with Image:PSP and DS.jpg. -- ReyBrujo 17:49, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

I didn't know it was for a size comparison... From the looks of how you had it in the page, it just seemed like you were showing a view of the main competitor and the subject... YSHOULDUKNOW123 20:17, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

Okay. Can we agree that having the original pic Image:PSP and DS.jpg is a good idea then, as it gives a realistic comparison of the platform sizes? --Oscarthecat 20:32, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

I have no problem with that. -- ReyBrujo 20:40, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

I actually am re-sizing the PSP in my image, so there is no need to! :) YSHOULDUKNOW123 20:57, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

Hmm... but what is wrong with the original one? Just wondering. You know, there is no need for replacing free images with free images, especially when one is a real life picture and another just a representation. As an example, it is like replacing a free picture of a human patting an elephant used to compare size with two images, an elephant and a human, pasted together to show the same. The real life image is always better. -- ReyBrujo 21:13, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

Hmm(2)....I agree with ReyBrujo on this. Not sure manually resizing it is a good idea. We still end up with a "photoshopped" image, rather than a "real world, side by side" image. --Oscarthecat 21:16, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

Okay, I changed it so that we could have one that was more neat and clean, instead of having one that has poor lighting, and a wooden table backround. Just making it more professional. YSHOULDUKNOW123 06:17, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

The images arn't a very good comparison, the top screen isn't flat down. Solidsnake204 21:18, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Game and Watch

I also believe the original image of Game & Watch is a bit better because it has a better focus than the new one. I am putting this threaded below the size topic because I think the new is based in the original one, if so then the upper side of the machine was modified, explaining the blurry effect. Opinions? -- ReyBrujo 21:27, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

• Original
  Original
• 
  New

I've updated the image twice, making major concerns to sharpness. It's now even more sharp than the original! YSHOULDUKNOW123 06:17, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

To be honest, I find the attempts to make the images more professional somewhat of a step backwards. I'm much more concerned about accurate representations, and the heavy airbrush approach just isn't doing it for me. Edges are uneven with the detail trimmed off, surface details and textures are washed out, proportions are a little off, the text looks like it was drawn in manually... This probably looks better for people who aren't really looking at the images, but for people who are using the images for informative purposes, the images don't cut it. You might as well just draw the image at that point, like what was done for the Wii Remote. Dancter 08:09, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Agh, these new images are incredibly fuzzy. It's very difficult to gauge an accurate bearing on the appearance of these items if you can't see them clearly. Furthermore, the Game and Watch image looks like it's merely had the top part cropped- you can see that the D-Pad on the system retains the "bent" appearance that the prior picture only had due to perspective. Ex-Nintendo Employee 12:59, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Okay, you can have your glare, and your fuzzyness (I'm absolutely sure that mine is more sharp than the original), and your scratches on the metal of the system. The glare on that photo is so bad you can't read Donkey Kong, nor Nintendo... YSHOULDUKNOW123 22:09, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

We don't want to give readers the impression that the Game and Watch system in question had melted. Sockatume 17:11, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

Rumors Section be Removed?

It doesn't seem to fit into this article, it's just plopped into the article with no real reason. Now if there were more rumors I could see the section working, but with such a little and old rumor I think it would be better without it. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 69.207.182.244 (talk • contribs) .

That seems ok, seeing as the section doesn't seem to fit, as you said. Balladofwindfishes 12:34, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Article Shortening Process

Yes, that's right, as you may have seen my (if I do say so myself) exeptional work on the article Nintendo, in which I dropped the page size from 64 KB to 32 KB, without disturbing the main data conveyed, I'm putting my attention on this article, to shorten it up, removing overly descriptive sentences that are uneeded, and doing whatever nessicary to keep that same great article, in a smaller form. It would be appriciated if you helped also! I'm going to ask ReyBrujo (who helped me with Nintendo) to help me! YSHOULDUKNOW123 22:14, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

maybe move the limited edition DS Lite sections to the DS lite page —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.97.197.161 (talk • contribs) .

DS headset

Was the DS headset ever released in Japan? The article says "It is slated for release in Japan on September 14, 2006". Either the date needs to be updated or the sentence needs to be changed to past tense. Koweja 15:45, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

I do believe that it was released, so I changed the sentence. Popplenrookie 19:11, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

GBA

The DS is not the Successor of the GBA. Nintendo has stated this, they are two different pillars.Rlk89 23:04, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

Nowhere in the article does it state that the DS is the successor of the GBA. The GBA, having a major basis for the hardware of the DS, is an ancestor (a predessesor) to said DS, but the GBA's successor is the GBA SP. The GBA SP's successor hasn't been revealed yet. Ex-Nintendo Employee 05:54, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

What? All i'm saying is the DS was the first of it's pillar, Tharefor has no predessesor.Rlk89 22:40, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Which is incorrect. The vast majority of the DS's circuitry is directly taken from the GBA SP. While the GBA SP's chosen successor is the GB Micro, both the Micro and the DS were preceded by the GBA SP. In fact, the original DS actually has more in common with the GBA SP than the GB Micro itself does. While it is incorrect to say the DS is the successor to the GBASP (Nintendo chose the GB Micro to do that), to ignore the direct lineage of the SP to the DS, especially given the fact that it's already been referenced in places where the GBA SP is a predecessor to the DS would also be incorrect. The DS is "not a Game Boy", but it does share the common heritage link with said device, the same as the Game Boy line shares a common heritage with the Game and Watch devices that preceded it. Ex-Nintendo Employee 01:29, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

I must say that I believe Ex-Nintendo Employee to be correct; although not part of the Game Boy line per se, the DS plainly counts the GBA and GBA SP among its 'ancestors'. Makron1n 12:25, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

Right. You wouldn't be able to play GBA games on it if it was purely stand-alone. -SaturnYoshi ^{THE VOICES} 14:46, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

Nintendo has explicitly stated it is not a game boy successor, so I really do not see the point of this argument. Supposedly the "real" successor is being designed.66.121.167.14 20:57, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

Nowhere in the article does it state that the DS is the successor to the GBA. The GBA, having a major basis for the hardware of the DS, is an ancestor (a predessesor) to said DS, but the GBA's successor is the GBA SP. The GBA SP's successor hasn't been revealed yet. Ex-Nintendo Employee 05:54, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

I disagree, I do not think that GBASP should be labelled its predecessor so matter-of-factly in the infobox. Similar hardware, yes, but Nintendo's intentions were to create a new line of systems, which would indicate that the DS is not in the same line of systems as the GBASP. We use predecessor and successor to state what was the DS before this DS was the DS, not to say that the DS has similarities in hardware to a different system in a different line of systems. The DS is no more predated by the GBASP than the Wii will be, regardless of similar hardware or not. We can't just use any single indicator we find to label the DS as having the GBASP predate it, it'd make as much sense as having whatever FF came before FFCrystal Chronicles and calling it the predecessor, and calling FFCC the predecessor to the next FF, so instead of FFX coming before FFXI, it comes before FFCC, and FFCC comes before FFXI.

Also, there is no fourth Game Boy, Iwata stated as such in a press release about the DS' success. - A Link to the Past (talk) 05:14, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

It's far, far more than just "similar" hardware- the vast majority of the DS's entire circuitry, from the electrical/power system to the ARM processor, everything down to the very physical "clicky" design of the buttons comes purely, directly from the GBA SP. You say that use "predecessor" and "successor" to define what was before the DS- well, that proves more than anything. The original GBA SP came before the DS and was the clear inspiration for the majority of its design, far more than just being "merely similar". Tossing the Wii in there makes absolutely no sense as well, since the Wii shares no common hardware or design traits with the GBA SP, while the DS's descendance from the original SP is clear and present. Final Fantasy comparisons are also irrelevant, since we don't have access to the internal code of the Final Fantasy games, so we have no way of seeing what internal components of one game carried over to the next. With the DS, on the other hand, we DO have access to the internal components, and we can clearly see that the GBA SP hardware AND design asthetics are at the very CORE foundations of the DS. The "predecessor" and "successor" links are there to give the reader the ability to "step through" and see design progression and influences. This is why the Game and Watch systems are described as the predecessor to the Game Boy, despite the fact that the line itself continued after the Game Boy's release. G and W became the lower of a "third pillar" strategy in the same veins as the Game Boy SP stood as the "third pillar" of Nintendo's strategy today.

Oh, and Nintendo came out and said that the claims about "no more Game Boys" was misconstrued, and that there may indeed be more Game Boys in the future. Ex-Nintendo Employee 23:00, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

I'm interested that you think the GBA SP, part of Nintendo's Gameboy line (their second pillar) is also part of their third pillar. But I digress: you lot need to stop editing the damn infobox until a concensus is reached. Take it to the Wikiproject, you'll find more editors over there and you should be able to hammer out a policy for similar situations in future. Sockatume 23:15, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

Tell that to LTTP, who keeps erasing stuff from the infobox, despite the fact that it's sourced material. And honestly, the "pillar" it stands for always seemed largely irrelevant in terms of discussion- it always seemed to me that the "pillar" strategem was based on emphasis in terms of marketing; first pillar went to the main console, second pillar went to Nintendo's featured console and third pillar went to the budget system, the older design. I could be completely wrong about that point, sure- but the design and asthetic origins of the DS cannot be ignored, especially when the sourced material clearly indicates that it's not just some guy on Wikipedia who can see the borrowed technology from the SP to the DS. Ex-Nintendo Employee 23:18, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

The fact that it is technologically the predecessor to the GBASP does not overcome the fact that it is not spiritually the predecessor or considered to be in the same line as the DS. And the G&W thing, it's not that the GBASP continued. It's just that it is not in the same line. Nothing came before DS.

The line is:

Nintendo DS - DS Lite

Game Boy - Game Boy Pocket - Game Boy Light - Game Boy Color - Game Boy Advance - Game Boy Advance SP - Game Boy micro - Game Boy Advance SP2

Game & Watch

I feel that there is poor logic to calling Game & Watch the predecessor to the Game Boy for the reason that it's a handheld and/or shares similar technology/circuitry. The DS is in its own line, and regardless of technological similarity, the DS' own line is more relevant, yet it's not even acknowledged and the DS is implied as the next Game Boy by having them read that the SP is its predecessor. The Game Boy isn't the NES' predecessor because it's a different system line. SNES continued the NES line, GBC continued the GB line, and DS created its own. - A Link to the Past (talk) 00:07, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

I disagree with you on several points.

First off, the Game and Watch both preceded the Game Boy, and I don't think you will find anyone here who will say that it had no influence on the Game Boy. From the Nintendo incarnation of the D-Pad, to Gumpei's knowledge of the use of LCD technology, the Game and Watch indeed the predecessor to the Game Boy line; as well, it continued as a "third pillar" even after the release of the Game Boy, for a time, in much the same way that the Game Boy and DS operate now. This has, of course, already been stated. And then you say "Nothing came before the DS". That would imply that the DS is an entirely new creation, one that bore absolutely no direct causal influence from the system that directly preceded it. This is, of course, patently untrue- the DS bears numerous DIRECT influences from the original GBA SP, ones that were already named. Similarily, your naming of the NES, or the SNES, again is irrelevant- the NES and the SNES, and similiarily the N64, all share almost nothing in common besides the Nintendo name. Trying to apply NES-SNES-N64 reasoning here takes the subject off course and doesn't address the main point.

Now, bearing in mind what I've said, and knowing I really hate fighting (especially fighting with you, LTTP), I am open to suggestions of a compromise regarding this matter. We could place a reference tag in the article that explicitly states Nintendo's marketing position that the DS is a physical predecessor to the GBASP (Original)- It's never been my intention to claim that the DS is the GBA's successor, merely to ensure that readers are aware of its original SP influences. Ex-Nintendo Employee 03:23, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

I hope this compromise works for both of us- we both agree that the SP (Original) is merely a technological predecessor to the DS, that the DS was not intended to replace the GBA SP. I've put a tiny blurb into the infobox so that, while readers remain aware of the technological influences, that nobody will get the wrong impression and think that the DS is the GBASP's sucessor. Ex-Nintendo Employee 03:30, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Can we say that the DS is an offshoot of the GBA? 67.188.172.165 03:51, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

Trivia section

I've excised all but 1 piece of trivia from the article as they were all along the lines of: "person X has a DS" or "in television program Y an item that looks like a DS is shown." Cheers. L0b0t 01:38, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

You could probably put up a comment to the tune of "The system's popularity has resulted in several appearances in pop culture, which are too numerous to be listed here", in order to discourage people from just putting the Trivia section back in. Mind you the last time I tried that approach it turned into "...which are too numerous to be listed here, however here are some examples:" followed by about 30 items. Sockatume 01:44, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

That is a good thing to try. Thanks. L0b0t 01:53, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

Lite Improvements

I think there are a few more important design improvements that should be mentioned in the DS Lite section of this article. The microphone's placement was changed from the bottom-right of the DS to the center of the clamshell hinge, making it easier for the player to keep their eyes on the screen. The power button was moved from just above the D-pad to the left outside side of the DS Lite and was designed to be held for a split-second before the system would shut down, making it harder to accidentally miss the D-pad and turn the power off instead (something I found very annoying). BeefJeaunt 01:50, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

Generally, I think most people would rather keep the information on the Nintendo DS Lite lighter (ha, get it?) on the original DS page, as to not make duplicate information for no reason. If anyone is curious about the differences, they can click on over to the Lite page (which is what every user of Wikipedia does and loves doing, because Wikipedia is made for this!) Mattygabe 23:50, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Homebrew references

It seems like most references to homebrew have been removed. Specifically, there is not direct link to the NDS homebrew page on the Wikipedia. This should be ammended... OOPMan —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 196.209.29.135 (talk • contribs) .

Infobox Image

Not only is the image's quality very poor, but the DS in the image is damaged (look at the hinge). I would like to see image:Nintendo_DS_Open.png restored, if there are no objections or copyright issues with the old image. Cosmos 22:41, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

Image:NDS.jpg? -- ReyBrujo 22:48, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

That's a nice one, but could somebody photoshop out the background so it is white, like a lot of articles on other systems have? Koweja 23:03, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

I replaced it with the original. We don't need a picture of Mario Kart DS. Hbdragon88 00:00, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

DS games references

I'm not sure if anyone is paying attention to the List of Nintendo DS games article, but it really needs some cleanup and alot of references. I worry that some games on the list might have been put there by vandals. dposse 01:20, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

I agree that it needs to be fixed up, i'm willing to help out Cocopopz2005 01:29, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

Great. Anyone else willing to cleanup the article? dposse 13:06, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

Update sales

The sales in Europe should be mentioned since, they have reached 7 million. [3] 74.137.230.39 22:51, 21 November 2006 (UTC)

Ds sales in europe

I do not know if this makes a difference, but DS has sold over 7 million units in Europe. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 195.194.74.227 (talk • contribs) .

Changes made to the page

I have made alterations to improve the page, yet they have been reverted, i checked the page history and it doesent mention anyone making changes after me..

Even more bizzare is that the page is now back to the form it was after my alterations, does anyone know what would cause this? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 195.194.74.227 (talk • contribs) .

Your changes were probably never reverted. It's just a problem of cache and your browser not updating correctly. Next time this happens, just try to refresh the page a few time to make sure your browser is displaying the actual page. 195.25.232.221 09:09, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

number of shipped console ?

Store sales are always more or less an estimation. Couldn't we also get the number of shipped console (like we get for the PSP) ?Doesn't nintendo release this number ?

As it is now, by reading both articles (DS and PSP) I don't feel like I have reliable and comparable sales chart for both device. DS article suggest a clear dominance by the DS, but PSP article only gives shipped systems numbers, wich are almost as much as sold DS.195.25.232.221 09:22, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

Sony never releases information on how many consoles or hand helds sold, so people think they have sold more.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 195.194.74.227 (talk • contribs) 10:40, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

Uk sales - 2 million

I did not know if this would effect the world wide sales, but its not 1.7 million now its over 2 million. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 195.194.74.227 (talk • contribs) 09:29, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

You should always properly cite your sources when introducing new information. In addition, it's best not to mix up numbers for different times. The numbers you changed were accurate for September 30, 2006, and didn't add up properly when you changed them, either for then or now. If the UK has sold over 2 million, it's best to make a separate, dated line item for that underneath, like what is done for the 7 million European sales info. Dancter 15:56, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

One source includes http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=150138 —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 86.135.163.194 (talk • contribs) 21:00, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

And if you examined my contributions, you can see that I had added the information to the article. I cannot see how my revert can justifiably be treated as vandalism, as I feel this is a legitimate dispute, in which I have made every reasonable effort to cooperate and abide by consensus. The three-revert rule restrictions still apply, and I doubt you will find an administrator who would think otherwise. It's far too early to resort to polling when discussion options have hardly been explored.

As I had mentioned in my previous comment, it is misleading to mix figures like in the revision you reverted to. The existing source does not assert that 8 million units were sold in Europe by September 30, 2006. Your previous edits seem to imply that information as it had been presented demonstrates a territorial bias, and I don't agree. The regional breakdown was based on information as provided by available sources for that particular point in time. This is why Japan was listed by itself, and why the United States had a sub-listing before you deleted it. The terms "The Americas" and "Other" were what Nintendo used. The latest figures for the UK and Europe also have been included, albeit separately, because they are for different times. I don't see why it is necessary to blunt factual detail that was presented accurately and objectively. Dancter 22:04, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

If Nintendo are being biased towards larger regions it does not mean Wikipedia does. I look at choosing larger countries shown as racist and not including smaller countries, its also biased.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 86.135.163.194 (talk • contribs) 07:43, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Systemic bias is definitely an issue on Wikipedia, but we don't deal with it by cutting the legs off existing information in the absense of available information from other viewpoints, and nowhere in the CSB recommendations is that idea mentioned. If you have sales figures for Liechtenstein, all the better. Based on your argument, we shouldn't be "singling out" information on the 2 million UK sales, either. The version you've reverted to contains a bias in itself by seemingly conflating PAL territories with Europe, which unfairly excludes Australasian countries which also use PAL. If the "Other" category Nintendo refers to is indeed identical to the "PAL region", then fine. But if there are differences, we are introducing new inaccuracy and bias not attributable to our sources, which is even worse than presenting the original bias. Heck, presenting a regional sales breakdown divided according to television display standards isn't even useful for the Nintendo DS, which doesn't connect to televisions. Dancter 18:03, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Just to add my point of view: we're going to wind up with a startling confusing article if we add in things like the UK release information. It's useful, but without current information from the other regions it's misleading and makes the article look shoddy. It's tempting to say "Well, we do Americas/Japan/Others and include a subregion for UK" but the last time I saw something like that the numbers simply didn't add up. We should use the most recent worldwide figures and nothing else. Sockatume 18:15, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Things like the 2 million UK sales milestone is already in the article, so if it's confusing to have it, we're already there. The old 5 million Japanese sales milestone has been in the article for quite some time with no complaint as far as I can tell. I've been very careful to make sure the numbers are presented accurately, and don't get mixed up. But I do understand about presentation concerns, and would accept the removal of the sales part from the "Marketing and sales" section altogether as somewhat "trivial" (in the sense that the separate factoids are a bit isolated, and aren't integrated that well), and just keep the worldwide sales in the infobox. Though I would like to hear some other opinions on the matter. I don't like being accused of racism. Dancter 18:46, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

I don't think it's racism when it's geography. I think the best bet is to use the most recent, single press release to include figures for all regions as the source for the Infobox, and include any other figures in the article text, where the dates can be clarified. So for example the Infobox would simply be "Americas / Japan / Other", while the main article would mention the more recent North America and UK figures. That way the infobox is unambigious but the article as a whole is still comprehensive. Sockatume 18:51, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

That's how I set it up for most of the other articles. I don't know why I didn't do that for this article. In retrospect, it was probably a mistake to use a bulleted list format. It seems to distract people enough that they don't tend to read the rest of the stuff in the section. Dancter 19:37, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

If you can turn it into a table that will be great, but if you do i want it in alpabetical order.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 81.159.155.153 (talk • contribs) 22:39, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

In response to your revert, if you read carefully the sources that were already there, the 7 million units European (not PAL region) sales figure was valid as of November 21, 2006, not September 30, 2006, and shouldn't be listed alongside figures for a different point in time, as has been mentioned multiple times in this discussion. If you examined the existing source for the September 30, 2006 sales information (last page of the PDF), 7.79 million units were sold in areas other than Japan and the Americas. It was completely valid and sourced as I had it. Dancter 00:35, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

Explains why you mentioned 7 million units, although i still stand by my statement of 8 million ds handhelds have been sold in the PAL region. Dancter when the figures are available one of us could put the correct sales for the NSTC region. After closer investigation i have found out about one more region SECAM, although i have no idea of the current sales for that region. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 195.194.74.227 (talk • contribs) 13:20, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

I'm sure that over 8 million Nintendo DS units have been sold throughout PAL territories by now, but a dated reliable source has not been shown that specifically asserts that. Despite the reasonable conjecture, until it is verified, it is technically original research, and shouldn't be stated in the article.

I'm assuming by "correct", you mean "up-to-date". The sales information is correct as it is. The sales numbers can be updated as soon as they are actually verified.

And like I said before, partitioning based on television standards makes no sense for Nintendo DS, as what television standard is used in some country has no bearing on a portable that doesn't connect to televisions. SECAM isn't even relevant for actual home consoles that do use television standards, as for the most part, televisions that support SECAM nowadays can do PAL. Home console manufacturers sell PAL consoles in SECAM territories. To use "PAL region" to describe the "Other" category Nintendo uses is not accurate. When it comes to television broadcast standards, France is a SECAM territory, but when describing home console sales, France is usually grouped into PAL for the standard used by the consoles that are sold there. There are no NTSC or PAL versions of the Nintendo DS. Dancter 16:49, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

DS Linux

should we have something about DSLinux? www.dslinux.org Wasn't there a section about it? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.104.205.76 (talk • contribs).

Oh i concur, the Nintendo DS has region coding for regions. Except japan their consoles can be used anywhere. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 81.129.191.243 (talk • contribs).

Since when has the Nintendo DS been region-coded? The DS and its games are all region-free. Mattygabe 23:29, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

First part

I just did some work on the first part of this page. Most of the info sould have been in the specs part. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 69.251.118.17 (talk • contribs).

Europe outselling America

Can anyone confirm if any other consoles (large scale consoles) have ever had these results. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 81.159.152.73 (talk) 22:41, 9 December 2006 (UTC).

Large Scale? I presume you're not including the GX4000 then! Tim 18:19, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

I'm not sure it's selling more over here than over there. Remember Others includes Australia and New Zealand. Sockatume 21:15, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Nintendo DS Image removed.

Someone added a picture of masturbation to the image for the DS. Image was removed from the page. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 74.195.238.42 (talk) 08:11, 16 December 2006 (UTC).

I don't see any masturbation. It looks like a DS. -- Consumed Crustacean (talk) 08:23, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

The masturbation picture must have been readded. Image removed again. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.45.20.23 (talk • contribs) 15:03, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

I don't understand anything about this supposed masturbation picture. Even when I look in the logs and histories, I can't see anything pointing to its existence. Dancter

Me neither, but you can be assured that it was there. I saw it early yesterday, and once it was removed, it was no longer in the history. BUt it WAS there. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.205.78.147 (talk • contribs) 15:54, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

What cockamamie, I saw and still see no difference. They're merely pulling your leg. Mattygabe 23:52, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

It's probably template vandalism that they're seeing, if they're being honest. It would have nothing to do with any of the images in the article, though. That's backed up by the unchanged history on said images. -- Consumed Crustacean (talk) 05:51, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

We can assure you, it was two pictures a a man holding his penis, but all that matters is that it's gone now. But it was there and it did happen. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.205.83.15 (talk • contribs) 19:54, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

It seems there have been reports elsewhere about the penis image, even off-wiki, also on December 15. It seems to no longer be an issue. Dancter 20:23, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, like I said, it was template vandalism. One of the templates on the page (i.e. Template:Infobox CVG system) was vandalised in such a way as to display the mentioned photo at the top of the page. This was going on and off for a few days, but it's apparently been dealt with. I saw it a few times myself, and helped somewhat to deal with it. Could have been worse :P. -- Consumed Crustacean (talk) 06:08, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

Citation for DS nicknames?

I thought about this myself but decided against it, and another user has decided that there should be citations for the various nicknames to the original DS that were added in the Trivia section. After Googling the terms, I realized that they were legitimate nicknames (all except one I discovered were legitimate for sure, that one may still be legit regardless). However, a "googling" cannot be accepted as a source of information. Does this need citation, or can this be considered "common knowledge"? Mattygabe 23:54, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Nicknames? Other than just referring to it as the "DS" (as opposed to Nintendo DS), I don't think I've ever heard of a single nickname for it. Happen to have any examples? Bladestorm 04:28, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

2 million sales in France

Just thought i would update you that another territory within the PAL region has surpassed 2 million sales, UK being the other one. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Special:Contributions/Ryan

Time Magazine Gadget of the Week award

I believe that we should mention Time Magazine awarding the DS with a Gadget of the Week award. It's mentioned in an issue of Time (maybe you won't see it, but the award appears in the Canadian edition of Time). The Legend of Miyamoto 22:31, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

WEP and WPA

It seems to me that the Nintendo DS only supports unsecure WEP Wi-Fi encryption and not WPA. Is that true? --Abdull 13:01, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

That seems to be about right. -- ReyBrujo 03:28, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

That's correct. While in the Nintendo WiFi Connection settings, if you attempt to access an Access Point that has WPA or WPA2 security encryption, it tells you that the AP is using an unsupported encryption method. Mattygabe 22:07, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Inaccurate sales figures

The united states actually has sold 6.5 million as of December 13, but since the page is locked i am unable to make the changes myself.

Source: http://www.aussie-nintendo.com/?v=news&p=9333 - Ryan —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 11Ryan (talk) 14:29, 2 January 2007 (GMT).

Your source reads, "6.5 million have been sold in the US as of November 30, 2006." I also don't know where the site is getting that information, but DS sales reached 6.2 million in the US as early as September 30,[4] and according to NPD reached 7.6 million as of November 30,[5] contradicting your source. Dancter 17:58, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Dancter your sales figures are for America not for the united states - Ryan —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 11Ryan (talk • contribs) 23:35, 2 January 2007 (GMT)

The sources I linked to both indicate that the figures are for the US. Dancter 23:51, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Frequent Vandalism

Does anyone have any ideas why this page attracts so much vandalism? It gets really irksome. What kind of idiots find this amusing? - Fearless Son 21:00, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Annoying, indeed. Irksome, yes indeed. Though it is very annoying for editors to revert all of the changes, it is also to be expected. With all of the fanboys from the PSP-DS flamewars making their natural way over here to Wikipedia, it's to be expected to see frequent vandalism. PSPs and DS's are mostly played by young, teen or pre-teenage kids who are, of course, immature. Their edits and actions here on Wikipedia will show that. You'll also most likely see that hot or popular topics find more vandalism than others, such is the case here. I do agree with you, though, that their immaturity is quite annoying and is one of the large drawbacks to having such an open community. Mattygabe 22:12, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Image

I don't know which works best in the infobox. One of my recent ones: Image:DSOnWhite.jpg (with a white background, fits in with the other console articles), Image:NintendoDS Warm.jpg (current image), or one of the others? -- Consumed Crustacean (talk) 18:20, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

Important games ??

Other consoles have a large section detailing the most important games released on the system. The DS is old enough that it has at least some highly notable games. Why is there no such section? I used Wikipedia to plan my Xbox purchases :) 24.227.20.234 10:00, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

Top selling games?

I don't have information for world wide sales, but Nintendogs is only 8th in Japan.[6] New Super Mario Brothers has sold almost 3 times as much as Nintendogs, and I would assume sales would have been high everywhere else too. Of course, it's all a moot point, as Pokemon Diamond / Pearl is easily going to take the lead as soon as it gets released in other countries.--SeizureDog 23:02, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Check the references we found for List of best-selling computer and video games#Nintendo DS. Nintendogs sold 7m worldwide, while NSMB 600k less. We have 8.51m for Brain Age, although that number appears to mix both Brain Age 1 and 2 in Japan, Brain Age 1 in Europe and America. -- ReyBrujo 02:26, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

DS Sales

The Nintendo DS sales figures have not been updated for awhile. I would like to see more recent sales figures. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 206.126.163.20 (talk) 04:20, 23 January 2007 (UTC).

DS MP3 Player/MP4 player

If the 66MHz CPU struggles to decode an MP3, then it is NOT going to manage an MP4 video which is a lot more power consuming. Nobody has mentioned WHO said all these fine and dandy things were coming? We (as developers) were told the GBA was going to support TV & it had TV throughput in it but was never used. Nintendo do this a lot. U think the MP4 thing is rubbish. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 81.104.26.110 (talk) 23:36, 23 January 2007 (UTC).

"The cause for such a low bit GUI is that to run MP3s the DS is forced to use the ARM9 processor, which is also used for running the GUI and most of the game code. Running MP3s on the ARM9 will use about 95% of it."

This is obviously incorrect information. The Nintendo MP3 Player is compatible with Gameboy Advance hardware, and uses its own internal processor for decoding MP3s - when running on a DS, it is running in GBA compatibility mode, without access to DS-specific hardware; the GBA does not contain an ARM9. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 82.71.43.253 (talk • contribs).

Sales by Quarter

When I first looked at the table displaying the number of units sold by quarter I was initially confused as to why there were already Quarter 4 sales listed if Quarter 3 for Nintendo just ended on Dec. 31. I then realized it was listing the sales by the quarters of the year instead of Nintendo's fiscal quarters. I feel that this section should either be changed to reflect the fiscal quarters of Nintendo or changed to list specific dates. Otherwise the chart can easily be misinterpretated. Zomic_13 19:11, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

Modying the DS.

Long ago I heard rumors that the original DS could be modded to play old gameboy games. Does anyone know if this is true? If it is it should be mentioned in the article as I find it noteworthy.--Iamstillhiro1112 02:45, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

Since the DS doesn't have the z80 chip in it, that would have to be one pretty significant mod (or very unusual homebrew emulator). Bladestorm 03:30, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

A homebrew emulator indeed exists for playing Gameboy games, though I have no idea how mature it is. See Nintendo_ds_homebrew#Emulators; there's a GBA-based emulator (the DS runs GBA code), and a plain DS emulator. -- Consumed Crustacean (talk) 06:19, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

Vandalism cleanup

Just a notice that this page has been subject to vandalism (profanity's hidden throughout the article)Laugh-O-Gram 15:10, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

Should one suggest semi-protection? --BiT 15:11, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

Technical Clarification

I was doing a general study of touch-screen based technologies, and I noticed something rather bizarre: What kind of touch-screen does the DS/DS-Lite use? When you read the screen specs, all you get is some rant about 92 lines of horizontal pixel and that certain games either account or do not account for. I don't think that's relevant in a technical specifictions section of any kind. Anyways, when you read the Wikipedia article about touch-screen styles, there is at least 5 or 6 types of touch-screens out there. So, which one is which? -- Dark Observer 01:07, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

Actually, upon reading the article further, I found that it does state that the DS's touch-screen is resistive, so ignore that. But the second thing I said is true. Dark Observer 01:19, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

Okay, sorry guys, I don't usually do Wikipedia talk pages, so I'm not entirely sure what the etiquette is here, but here goes anyway. There's a comment in the specifications section of the article that refers to the 3d rendering capability as being in between the Nintendo 64 and Playstation. I find two possible problems with this statement; the first is that the DS is clearly more powerful than the Nintendo 64, as it has run graphically enhanced versions of Nintendo 64 games. Logic would therefore indicate that a PSX<NDS<N64 hierarchy is impossible. Which brings us to the other problem. The other possible hierarchy would be N64<NDS<PSX, which contributes to a myth perpetuated by Sony that the Playstation was more powerful than the Nintendo 64. Anyone who has read a spec sheet knows that this isn't true, and there are several comparisons that can be made that prove this a farcical statement. I suggest that the article be corrected to reflect the DS's rendering capability as being above that of the Nintendo 64, but not necessarily comparing to other systems (particularly from Sony, as this is bound to incite a flame war.) After all, the NDS is essentially a two-screened N64 with the bilinear filtering capability removed, from a graphic standpoint. Thanks for your time fellas, hope the issue gets resolved - Ryojikaji46290@hotmail.com —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.147.81.231 (talk • contribs) 01:42, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

I added a notice requesting improvement to that section. Much of the information there seemed to be unattributed, and the one reference cited is a blog post that is probably not a reliable source. I've sent you a message with some helpful links. Welcome to Wikipedia. Dancter 02:53, 15 March 2007 (UTC)