Talk:Project Dark Gene

Note to other user

You posted; {{multiple issues|disputed=February 2011|hoax=February 2011|notability=February 2011|one source=February 2011}} into the article after I'd barely started writing it. I don't know how you stumbled upon the article so soon after I began writing it or why you didn't see that it was still being built, but I'm not going to 'argue' that you're wrong by placing those tags to the article as I don't know the convention. However I do know the convention for articles on shoot down's between the USSR and USA during the Cold War. This project was mentioned in that article and where there is enough information for a more in depth explanation as to why there is typically an article. Since this project was essentially the reason Colonel Saunders got shot down, I thought I'd write the article.--Senor Freebie (talk) 05:36, 3 February 2011 (UTC)

On second thoughts I am going to dispute some of your assumptions but not before I mention again how strange it is that you jumped onto this article so quickly. First of all, the claim that this is a hoax, based on a single reference, when the author is used as a reference regularly on wikipedia and is well known for covering and researching these sorts of programs is strange. Secondly, there is actually 3 sources that corroborate each other on aspects of the program as well as no doubt further sources if you start to dig (such as the Soviet Pilots medal). On top of this, the program is well within the scope of Cold War operations and is not 'something exceptional'. It is just the operation relevant to Iran. On top of that given there is material evidence to the programs existence in a museum in Iran and in the modern Iranian Air Force, it seems highly questionable to jump onto an article only just created to spam 'unreliable' tags on it. That said, I will not remove them until you give a counter-argument.--Senor Freebie (talk) 05:41, 3 February 2011 (UTC)

In response to each item, which I am now removing, since it seems the user who added them merely patrols recently created articles without considerable follow-up I will list my reasons for removing the tag:

{{multiple issues}}

Obviously contextual

{{disputed=February 2011}}

No one has disputed the factual accuracy of the sources

{{hoax=February 2011}}

No one has labelled the information in the sources a hoax

{{notability=February 2011}}

Similar articles exist covering other ELINT operations from the Cold War. This particular operation led to shoot downs, prisoners of war and therefore some of the 'hotter' moments of the Cold War, especially for the region.

{{one source=February 2011}}

Redundant, as there are now 4 sources listed.--Senor Freebie (talk) 07:46, 3 February 2011 (UTC)

Just a further note; as far as I'm concerned I'm done editing this article. I think its a good start. There is now 7 references and an image that was already up on the Russian wikipedia page. I refrained from adding a picture of Colonel Saunders as I didn't know if it was a free image (US government images are but perhaps it was taken by Iranians?). Also, I don't think there is much more information readily available to English only speakers. Perhaps there is some Iranian or Russian sources that could be trawled?--Senor Freebie (talk) 08:34, 3 February 2011 (UTC)

Related Information

It seems that this project along with its sister project (IBEX) gave a collection of CIA agents significant amounts of money. Many of these agents went on to participate in the Iran Contra affair, also a major source of personal income. This seems to have given them the capacity to fund their own initiatives outside the scope of collaborative CIA operations. If anyone has any further information on this (read sources) I wouldn't mind putting it into this article as well as the collective articles for people like Hakim, Secord etc. So far I only have Wheaton's allegations and coming from only one source seems a little weak.--Senor Freebie (talk) 07:18, 12 February 2011 (UTC)

File:Captain Gennadii N. Eliseev.jpg Nominated for speedy Deletion

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Shah of Iran

The Shah may have been "a U.S. ally", but he did not "come to power with help from the CIA". He inherited the throne. The 1953 upheaval in Iran did involve the CIA - along with many other players, but the US role was minor, and the Shah was ruler throughout.Royalcourtier (talk) 05:30, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

 LOL! --RussellSenior (talk) 09:18, 8 April 2021 (UTC)

References

Another source mentioning the Soviet pilot downed

http://az-libr.ru/route/route.php?Persons/000/Src/0007/56ffae33.shtml