Talk:Shades of blue

Remove school colors?

Recently, school colors have found their way into this article. They probably should be deleted or moved to a new article concerning blue in school uniforms or to the articles on each school. Most of these school colors' notabilities extend no farther than the boundaries of the school, and since there are many schools with blue as a school color, half the shades of blue listed here could be school colors Purplebackpack89≈≈≈≈ 23:59, 15 July 2011 (UTC)

Question on title

Please see question at Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Color#Why_use_phrase_.22Varitations_of_....22_instead_of_.22Shades_of_....22. --Noleander (talk) 19:45, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

Anybody watching

I'd like to volunteer to sort these colors by hue. It would make them a lot more understandable and give them more context. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.46.108.115 (talk) 01:50, 23 December 2014 (UTC)

Anyone watching this article may want to include Wedgwood blue as it seems to be recognized by our sister site. Thanks, hydnjo (talk) 23:40, 10 June 2012 (UTC)

Federal Blue

"Federal Blue" redirects here, from the template, but the article itself makes no mention of the color. Either the template should be fixed to eliminate colors that do not have pages, a section on Federal Blue should be added, or a new Federal Blue article created. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.247.94.80 (talk) 04:00, 27 September 2012 (UTC)

• Likewise "ceil" is listed on the list of colors and links to blue, but is not in the blue article itself. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 110.174.121.141 (talk) 02:08, 29 January 2013 (UTC)

• Likewise "French Blue". Kiltpin (talk) 23:22, 24 February 2013 (UTC)
• There is an article for Cobalt blue too. It should probably be added as well. Infodater (talk) 01:39, 8 February 2014 (UTC)

Blue (Munsell)

According to http://www.cis.rit.edu/research/mcsl2/online/munsell_data/real.dat Munsell’s “5B” is at x = 0.0965, y = 0.1558 in CIE 1931, which is close to 482 nm spectral and is anything bluish but certainly not #0093AF, a variation of cyan. Apparently some master of transformation contaminated Wikipedia with flawed Munsell-to-modern-systems data and all patterns of Munsell colors shall be re-examined. Incnis Mrsi (talk) 05:37, 17 June 2013 (UTC)

Some Munsell colors of equally spaced hues and (semi-arbitrarily) varied value/chroma to fit in the sRGB gamut.

"Munsell Blue" is not a color, and Munsell colors by definition don’t have color names – Indeed the whole point of Munsell’s system is to get away from a system of using names for colors, which he thought was unscientific and idiotic. No color called “Munsell” anything is appropriate for this page. The colors used on the article about the Munsell Color System all still seem completely fine to me. In particular, the colors shown in the image to the right are just fine, for what they are. –jacobolus (t) 05:25, 18 June 2013 (UTC)

I do not see anything idiotic in names, but… we talk specifically about 5B, isn’t it? You see these sRGB colors fine, I do not, and it’s this which is unscientific. The image at right is not a reliable source. Incnis Mrsi (talk) 06:12, 18 June 2013 (UTC)

In that data table, if you want to find a relevant color to look at, you want to be looking down for a color something along the lines of 5B 6/16, which has x=0.1310, y=0.2048, Y=30.050 (though I don’t remember precisely which lightness/chroma I used for the blue in that picture). Then you need to do a chromatic adaptation from the Illuminant C of the original data to a white point like D65. I recommend using CIECAT02, but I think I might have used the Bradford CAT when I ran the numbers the first time. –jacobolus (t) 05:38, 18 June 2013 (UTC)

x = 0.1310, y = 0.2048 is obviously a tint pushed deeply inside the sRGB gamut far beyond necessity. Such desaturated colors should not be used as alternative definitions (of blue, or whatever color term unless it inherently refers to a tint). So, do you agree to just drop it? Incnis Mrsi (talk) 06:12, 18 June 2013 (UTC)

I thought better and now I am not sure that it is deeply inside sRGB. But the method in any case is questionable if desaturation results in an RGB representation which lies so far from original spectral color. Maybe, the article needs two patters of “5B”, not one? The first for most saturated Munsell color which fits to sRGB, and the second for a reasonable visual approximation of an intended spectral? Incnis Mrsi (talk) 08:25, 18 June 2013 (UTC)

The “dominant wavelength” of a color is not a very good attribute to use when trying to understand its hue, and there’s great difficulty representing something like a spectrum with a medium like a computer display. I think you’re getting stuck on some ideas/calculations that seem contradictory/incorrect, but would be immediately cleared up if you read a book or two about color science. The best resource I know on the web is http://www.handprint.com/LS/CVS/color.html but it’s rather long and a bit rambling. If you want I can recommend some paper books. Also, if you get the chance ever, try to look at a physical Munsell Book of Color. The way its color chips are organized would likely make a great deal more sense. –jacobolus (t) 06:59, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

It appears that 5B 6/16 would make the most sense as "Blue (Munsell)" if one is going to define such a color (rather than 5B 5/8). If the goal is to use a similar line of thinking as 100% saturation (high saturation) and 50% lightness (medium lightness point), then Munsell value 6 is the median value (from 0 to 12) and then use the most saturated chroma value that's within Munsell hue 5B. According to [1] (p. 20), that value is 5B 6/16. Bumm13 (talk) 20:32, 20 May 2019 (UTC)

Nevermind, the correct value is 5 and not 6; that would make 5B 5/16 the closest (citeable) Munsell color, which is   rather than  . Also, I agree that the Munsell color wheel image should not be used as a source as it doesn't seem to be based on actual Munsell values but vague approximations. Bumm13 (talk) 21:17, 20 May 2019 (UTC)

With respect to Munsell primary color approximations (in sRGB), I think Wikipedia editors need to decide what they want: the most saturated and lightest (highest value) color the Munsell system covers for a specific hue or the most saturated color for a median (5/n color) shade of hue. It can't be both (usually); we need a consistent methodology when dealing with Munsell color approximations. Cheers! Bumm13 (talk) 22:02, 20 May 2019 (UTC)

Just to add more to the discussion here, the following template image uses "6/6" value/chroma for the example Munsell primaries:

Munsell hues; value 6 / chroma 6

5R |				5YR |				5Y |				5GY |				5G |				5BG |
	201 130 134	201 130 127	201 131 118	200 133 109	197 135 100	193 137 94	187 140 86	181 143 79	173 146 75	167 149 72	160 151 73	151 154 78	141 156 85	127 159 98	115 160 110	101 162 124	92 163 134	87 163 141	82 163 148	78 163 154	73 163 162
5BG |				5B |				5PB |				5P |				5RP |				5R |
	73 163 162	70 162 170	70 161 177	73 160 184	82 158 189	93 156 193	104 154 195	117 151 197	128 149 198	141 145 198	152 142 196	160 140 193	168 138 189	177 135 182	183 134 176	188 132 169	193 131 160	196 130 153	198 130 146	200 130 140	201 130 134

About "dark blue" it's misleading

The page says that "dark blue" is some specific measured colour within a certain standard. Of course this is silly because 99% of the time it just means any blue that is dark (e.g. when you describe someone's car, or the night sky). The fact that "dark blue (color)" redirects to this overspecific trivia is misleading to readers. Probably same with many other everyday colour names. Equinox ◑ 03:23, 25 December 2017 (UTC)

Possible removal from list

Colors removed

An entry in List of colors: A–F contained a link to this page. The entry is (are): Caribbean blue Catalina blue Chinese blue I don't see any evidence that this color is discussed in this article and plan to delete it from the list per this discussion: Talk:List_of_colors#New_approach_to_review_of_entries If someone decides that this color should have a section in this article and it is added, I would appreciate a ping.--S Philbrick(Talk) 19:07, 3 October 2018 (UTC) Entries in List of colors: A–F contained links to this page. The entries are : Ceil Crystal Crystal blue Dark blue-gray Dark Navy Dark pastel blue Delicate girl blue Diamond Entries in List of colors: G–M contained links to this page. Lotion blue Metallic blue An entry in List of colors: N–Z contained a link to this page. The entry is : Philippine blue Sea blue I don't see any evidence that these colors are discussed in this article and plan to delete them from the list per this discussion: Talk:List_of_colors#New_approach_to_review_of_entries Note: It was added here and removed here If someone decides that this color should have a section in this article and it is added, I would appreciate a ping.--S Philbrick(Talk) 19:06, 3 October 2018 (UTC)

Royal blue

I'm working on reviewing entries in List of colors: N–Z.

That list has two entries for royal blue, each of which points to this article, yet there seems to be no discussion of royal blue in the article. This seems like a major omission.--S Philbrick(Talk) 19:09, 3 October 2018 (UTC)

Relocated cultural content

The following "cultural" content of the color blue has been relocated here as a holding place, pending its integration into the page Blue, or, ideally, combined with content from that overlong page, into its own article. Wikiuser100 (talk) 14:27, 9 March 2019 (UTC):

==Variations of blue in culture==

Blueberries

Note: For blue in general in culture, please go to the main article on the color blue

Cartography

• In historical atlases published in Germany, light blue is traditionally used as a color to represent Germany, as opposed to pink for England and the British Empire, purple for France, and light green for Russia.

Fashion

• Dark clothing for males such as black, brown, or dark blue business suits have become much more popular since the mid-1990s, as opposed to the pastel colored business suits worn in the 1970s by major leaders in such institutions as the United States Congress (the vast difference in the clothing worn in the 1970s as opposed to the 2000s can be readily seen by looking at a videotape of the Watergate hearings).

Film and TV

• The British science-fiction TV series Doctor Who features a time traveling police box known as the TARDIS. The phone boxes were used in Britain during the 1950s and 60s. The phone box has become an icon of pop culture, with the term ‘TARDIS Blue’ being used in the context of the show, and the real world to describe the shade.

German police officer

Law Enforcement

• In many parts of the world, police wear dark blue uniforms.

Sexuality

• In Russian, the word for sky blue, голубой, can be used to mean a 'male homosexual'.

• In English, phrase "blue joke" means dirty joke (a joke intended for adults; see blue comedy).

Sociology

• Also, the term blue blood usually refers to the European nobility or upper class, and is based on a medieval belief that the royal blood was blue. In its ironical sense, the term may refer to snobbism and arrogancy.
• Dark blue or medium blue can also represent the working class. A blue-collar worker is a member of the working class who typically performs manual labor and earns an hourly wage. Industrial and manual workers wear durable clothing that can be dirty, soiled, or even scrapped at work. A popular element of such clothes has been a light blue or navy blue work shirt and blue is also a popular color for work coveralls, the shirts and coveralls both typically made from denim.
• At the Oxford and Cambridge Boat Race on the Thames in London, dark blue is the color of the University of Oxford and light blue is the color of the University of Cambridge. Dark blue and light blue are also nicknames for students of these respective universities.

References

Commons files used on this page have been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons files used on this page have been nominated for deletion:

• India new 50 INR, MG series, 2018, obverse.jpg (discussion)
• India new 50 INR, MG series, 2018, reverse.jpg (discussion)

Participate in the deletion discussions at the nomination pages linked above. —Community Tech bot (talk) 23:02, 9 June 2019 (UTC)

Argentinian blue

The color Argentinian blue has been listed on this page for some time with a source of X11. However, Argentinian blue is not the name of any color in the X11 color set, and it's not a web color. It doesn't even appear on ColorHex or Encycolorpedia, and the hex code #6cb4ee is not even mentioned in the lengthy article on the flag of Argentina. Is anyone opposed to its removal? Altay8 (talk) 21:28, 29 October 2019 (UTC)

Argentine Blue is RGB 116 172 223 or Hex #74ACDF. It represent the sky but its closest name is now known as Jordy blue via Resene paints of New Zealand. It is also the colour of the original Northland Rugby jerseys of New Zealand although mistakenly their colours got called Cambridge and now knows as Sky Blue. I'd be happy to be contacted on this further. IMMSNZ (talk) 17:05, 16 September 2023 (UTC)

"Erroneous variations of blue"

I don't see a lot of citations here. Is there a source for the definition of "blue" used to recategorize these colors as "erroneous"? In other languages, azure may be considered a primary color, but I note that the Oxford English Dictionary defines azure as "a bright blue pigment or dye", "the blue colour in coats of arms", "the clear blue colour of the unclouded sky", etc.. Of the examples given here, "baby blue" is defined as "a pale shade of blue", "powder blue" as "a soft pale shade of blue", "ice blue" as "of a very pale blue colour", and so on. Chronodm (talk) 18:57, 28 February 2021 (UTC)

I think that depends on how vague should we classify these colors. Objectively, the most vague definition of blue, with a hue of 240, would be any color within a range of 180-300. This definition stems from the perspective that blue is a primary color. If cyan can be classified as a variation of blue, than magenta can as well. If we are to add cyan colors to the page, than we must be willing to add magenta colors to the page too.

Since we are willing to give a tertiary color, orange, the honor of specification (giving it its own page and not listing its colors on the red and yellow pages), than all other colors that came before it must follow suit. The definition of blue that stems from the perspective that blue is a tertiary color means that, with a hue of 240, any color within a range of 225-255 is a variation of blue, and any color outside of that range is not considered a shade of blue unless you make the definition of blue more vague.

The same applies to all the other primary colors; yellow and cyan are considered variations of green, and yellow and magenta are considered shades of red, no matter how radically different they look from the primary colors.

Personally, if orange, a tertiary color, is allowed the honor of specification, then all the other colors up to tertiary (which include primary and secondary) deserve it too, or else it would be inconsistent, and I don't want the wiki to be inconsistent. ThunderBrine (talk) 21:44, 8 March 2021 (UTC)

Wikipedia needs to follow the sources, if color terms are inconsistent, it is not Wikipedia's place to make them consistent. PaleAqua (talk) 22:12, 8 March 2021 (UTC)

Support But why the heck are shades of cyan listed as blue unnecessary overlaps in the the templates not just for blue but also many others consistency please. 78.1.9.100 (talk) 11:26, 13 May 2023 (UTC)

References

School colours should be removed

As "discussed" (more accurately, "raised") back in 2011, school colours are unnecessary and violate NPOV. Their inclusion also falls afoul of Template:Advert and Template:Globalize too, but that's getting ahead of ourselves.

A simple excision from this page (and if anyone is really interested, a re-inclusion on their respective school page) is required.

2001:8003:8C21:1400:8C4F:A5AE:1C5F:FAB7 (talk) 13:36, 8 December 2021 (UTC)

picotee blue

It says the colour comes from the picotee flower but clicking the link, and searching for picotee, does not come up with any blue flowers, and instead suggests picotee is not a type of flower but a pattern, and not necessarily a blue pattern. 84.71.1.137 (talk) 15:24, 12 May 2022 (UTC)

Merge

I tagged this and shades of azure for tagging. Even a quick glance at just how many shades on the azure page have blue in the name show that there is zero reason for a split. The unsourced "hue angle" OR nonsense has been removed. There's no reason to have two separate lists when azure is simple a shade of blue itself. oknazevad (talk) 05:47, 26 January 2023 (UTC)

Also note that the {{Shades of azure}} template was already merged to the shades of blue template following a TFD. oknazevad (talk) 06:15, 26 January 2023 (UTC)

No just no azure is not just a shade of blue it's a CMYK tertiary color. 78.1.9.100 (talk) 11:20, 13 May 2023 (UTC)

• Support This has been open for a long time, so I'm willing to close it. I'll make a calendar reminder for two weeks from now.

―Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 23:18, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support - IMO just because of WP:COMMONNAME, literally who looks up "azure" instead of blue? Also, it literally says in the azure article how it is a shade of blue, which is completely redundant. Def merge. phrogge 'sup?

edits 04:39, 1 March 2023 (UTC)

• SupportTo build on what Phrogge wrote, there's not much more in 'azure' or shades of 'blue' than a dictionary definition. Without starting with blue it is difficult to describe 'azure' or 'shades of blue'. — Neonorange (talk to Phil) (he, they) 06:45, 28 April 2023 (UTC) —

 Done ―Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 06:47, 18 July 2023 (UTC)

How to download only one colour

How to download only one colour 2402:3A80:1CAD:8E13:E90:1E7:A41E:AB4B (talk) 07:41, 16 March 2023 (UTC)

The RGB system has wrecked blue

Blue traditionally, and I believe, still is, thought to have the archetype of a colour around the hue of 203 degrees in the HSV colour wheel. For me, that RGB 0000FF blue is a different hue, I call it ultramarine. It has a hint of violet in it and it's the same difference to blue as red is to orange. Cyan is also not the archetypical blue, it's too close to green. The blue of the ocean is nowhere near that searing ultramarine colour, it's actually a darkened version of the blue around 203 degrees. The colour of the sky is also around 210 degrees. Munsell's blue makes so much more sense to be the archetype. My point is, RGB blue is too far from being the archetypical blue. The colour 'azure' is significantly closer to the archetype. Restfultree2022 (talk) 11:58, 13 April 2023 (UTC)

The starting point should be what sources considered reliable by Wikipedia have to say about different 'shades of blue'. RGB colors seen, I suppose, on some type of tablet, camera, monitor screen or television are rarely very accurate. With a $5000 USD critical video monitor and a calibrator of similar cost the color could be 99% accurate, but otherwise not so much. Any discussion with citations will not be useful because there would be so many different opinions. — Neonorange (talk to Phil) (he, they) 06:35, 28 April 2023 (UTC) —

Colors listed as blue

Why the heck are shades of cyan and indigo listed as shades of blue? Some obviously don't belong like electric indigo or aquamarine. Why are they still listed as blue and for the love of God don't even think about merging shades of blue and shades azure that would be a major inaccuracy on your part and vague , meaningless descriptions are not helping the cause. 78.1.9.100 (talk) 11:18, 13 May 2023 (UTC)

Neptune blue

Neptune blue is a darkish blue, the color of Neptune. -- Given that the image that this is based on is false color, as revealed recently, this entry may have to be reworded (or removed entirely). Renerpho (talk) 08:38, 23 February 2024 (UTC)

The page has been edited since. It now says Neptune blue is a darkish blue, the false color of Neptune, but "the false color of Neptune" is not just ambiguous, it is meaningless. Literally every color (except its true one) is a false color of Neptune. I suggest to be rather more specific, like so: Neptune blue is a darkish blue, the false color in which a famous picture of the planet Neptune that was taken by the Voyager 2 spacecraft in 1989 was colorized for its initial publication. Renerpho (talk) 20:37, 5 March 2024 (UTC)

“Blurple” has changed

I found it somewhat out of place that the color that Discord uses is in this list, but whatever. Anyways, Discord recently did a brand refresh, and the color they use as “Blurple” changed, so I don’t know if this list should be updated based on that. Wiichicken (talk) 03:31, 13 June 2024 (UTC)

Requested split of Shades of azure

Shades of azure should probably be split out from this article (with a brief mention in the lead here). Right now it's unnecessarily bloating this page, which is already huge due to the presence of "ambiguous variations". I know that the merge was done just 10 months ago, but surely there's a better alternative than this absurdly long list of colors (exacerbated by infobox color and the section clears). Reconrabbit 19:01, 17 June 2024 (UTC)

Nah. There really isn't. Azure is not a thing in modern English: it's just a shade of blue and absolutely belongs here. — LlywelynII 09:12, 30 June 2024 (UTC)

Requested linguistic section

For this namespace, we should have some cursory treatment (with links to deeper coverage) over languages like Russian and modern Mongolian that deeply divide blue into separate shades to the point that they're considered as distinct from one another as green is from all these blues in English. If the categories don't overlap, leave it at that. If they strongly overlap across languages, we should split our complete treatment of blues to show which ones fall into which baskets in those other cultures, with an understanding that intermediate shades are intermediate. — LlywelynII 09:12, 30 June 2024 (UTC)