Template:Did you know nominations/Wilhelmine Lübke

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Cwmhiraeth (talk) 05:27, 23 July 2019 (UTC)

Wilhelmine Lübke

(

)

Wilhelmine and Heinrich Lübke greet Queen Sirikit of Thailand at a state dinner, 1960

~~... that Wilhelmine Lübke, a teacher, was the wife of Germany's President Heinrich Lübke and represented her country internationally (pictured)?~~ Source: several

Reviewed: No Place to Go (2000 film)
Comment: best on her birthday, 9 May

Created by Gerda Arendt (talk). Self-nominated at 19:39, 3 May 2019 (UTC).

Article is new enough, long enough, QPQ has been done, German sources accepted in good faith, no close paraphrasing seen. The hook fact is interesting, but it only appears to be explicitly mentioned in the lede. In addition, much of the article, including the hook fact, lacks footnotes. Narutolovehinata5 ^tccsdnew 12:31, 4 May 2019 (UTC)

The hook fact is on a quite official image. Do you want it in writing? - The translation had no inline citation, as usual, I'm in the process of finding the things. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:04, 4 May 2019 (UTC)

More precisely: do we need a ref for the wife of a countries president representing her country internationally? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:06, 4 May 2019 (UTC)

Yes. Narutolovehinata5 ^tccsdnew 13:08, 4 May 2019 (UTC)

I commented out what I can't find a ref for.

ALT1: ~~... that Wilhelmine Lübke, a teacher, received with her husband, Germany's President Heinrich Lübke, Queen Sirikit (pictured) and Elizabeth II?~~ --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:23, 4 May 2019 (UTC)

I honestly prefer the original hook, only that the sourcing and inline mention issues should be resolved first. Narutolovehinata5 ^tccsdnew 14:00, 4 May 2019 (UTC)

I fail to understand what else you need. We have a ref for more than 50 visits. Do you question that she was his wife? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:04, 4 May 2019 (UTC)

I think you're a bit confused here Gerda. What I was trying to say is that the hook fact was not explicitly mentioned in the article text, not that it wasn't sourced. The article text only sort of implies it but the connection between those mentions and "represented her country internationally" is not immediately clear. This issue and the problem of there being a lack of sources for some paragraphs were two separate issues. Narutolovehinata5 ^tccsdnew 14:13, 4 May 2019 (UTC)

Narutolovehinata5, it is explicitly mentioned in the lead, as a summary of source information in the body. There are no unsourced statements left, afaik. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:18, 4 May 2019 (UTC)

@Gerda Arendt: regarding placement, is it really necessary to have this hook on May 9? We already have the birthday of Katie Bouman. BTW I think it's rather condescending to mention Bouman's age. We wouldn't write a hook like that for a man. Yoninah (talk) 12:16, 6 May 2019 (UTC)

Bouman's age has nothing to do with this nom. - Define necessary. I wrote the article in response to WIR, May women. Can't help that her birthday is early in the month. Better later than without image, I'd say, and yes, she's dead, so will not enjoy placement, - it's just fond memory on out part. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:39, 6 May 2019 (UTC)

Also, with Narutolovehinata5 as reviewer, it may take weeks until approval is reached. One is open dating from February. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:41, 6 May 2019 (UTC)

To respond to the above comment, I check daily all nominations that I've commented on, even if I don't regularly reply. If there's no response in a while, it can be taken to mean that I'm asking for more opinions from other editors. Narutolovehinata5 ^tccsdnew 13:26, 6 May 2019 (UTC)

I had hoped for a word for THIS nom, with some birthday urgency. February motets can wait. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:21, 6 May 2019 (UTC)

As much as I would have agreed to this going up on her birthday (and in fact, I'm willing to approve this today as there are few if any remaining issues), Yoninah's comments above suggest that the request may not have been granted even if the review was accomplished immediately. Not all date requests can be accommodated due to various reasons (even I have experienced such issues before). Narutolovehinata5 ^tccsdnew 21:03, 6 May 2019 (UTC)

The image is good for a lead slot. Take your time and fix the hook so it's also good for a lead slot. Thanks, Yoninah (talk) 21:09, 6 May 2019 (UTC)

What's missing, hookwise? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:44, 6 May 2019 (UTC)

I don't think there are any remaining problems. I think the "state visits" section is now good enough, and no more sentences need to be referenced. Should now be good to go. @Yoninah: Your call if the special occasion request will be granted, though as far as I know it's not against the rules to have more than one SOR hook in a set. Narutolovehinata5 ^tccsdnew 00:13, 7 May 2019 (UTC)

But if Gerda wants the image slot, it will have to wait for another day. The black hole is too good to pass up. Yoninah (talk) 01:01, 7 May 2019 (UTC)

Thank you, both, and yes, have the black hole again, and she can wait ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:11, 7 May 2019 (UTC)

Gerda, I'm ready to promote this, but the first hook is kind of blah and the second hook has too much name-dropping. Can we say something more specific?
ALT2: ... that First Lady of Germany Wilhelmine Lübke (pictured, center) was fluent in English, French, Spanish, Italian and Russian, in contrast to her husband, President Heinrich Lübke, who had difficulties with foreign languages? Yoninah (talk) 22:43, 29 June 2019 (UTC)

Can we say it without blaming him? Several references say that some sources for his alleged mistakes are not reliable. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 06:09, 30 June 2019 (UTC)

So please rewrite that part in the article. Meanwhile, here is another alt:
ALT3: ... that Wilhelmine Lübke (pictured, center), who joined her husband, President of Germany Heinrich Lübke, on more than 50 state visits, was fluent in English, French, Spanish, Italian and Russian? Yoninah (talk) 12:54, 30 June 2019 (UTC)

Thank you, I like that one --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:32, 30 June 2019 (UTC)

Thank you! Pinging @Narutolovehinata5: for a review of ALT3. Yoninah (talk) 19:45, 30 June 2019 (UTC)

Sounds good to me. AGF for the German source. Narutolovehinata5 ^tccsdnew 00:33, 7 July 2019 (UTC)