Interviews with students in the treatment group (pseudonyms protect their confidentiality) were collected to gain insights into how students were thinking about their educational and career plans, their perceptions of what might be required to reach them, and what they believed might help or hinder them during that process.
3.3.1. Developing Postsecondary Interests
Most students interviewed described some level of interest in a STEM-related career. However, participant responses ranged considerably between firm, bourgeoning, and vague plans. For example, Renee, who appeared to be relatively firm in her plans, said, “[I want to] get my bachelor’s degree like my sister has before … I want to major in engineering. It’s engineering. I don’t know what type exactly yet. But it’s engineering”. Another student, Nivea, shared her plan along with a specific college: “Johns Hopkins is actually one of my first choices … I would say software engineering, or computer science is my top two [choice of majors].”
In contrast, some students seemed to have doubts about their emergent plans. A male sophomore, Jean-Paul, shared:
I would like to go to college to get my engineering degree or computer engineering degree because that’s what I wanted to do. Right now I’m just having second thoughts … When I first came [to this country], my plan was just computer engineering … But right now, I’m just having second thoughts about how everything’s working out and how to get to everything. I’m just having doubts about myself being good enough to do the job that I’m supposed to be doing … I may have good grades, but I don’t think rationally like everybody else. I don’t think clear. I mostly learn things from just watching.
Similarly, Vivian expressed her plans in vague terms but expressed confidence about her interests:
I know I want to enroll to a four-year college … I do want to do something in STEM. I don’t really like politics or history. I love science, I love math. I think more, I love engineering, but I don’t really know if I would really want to major in that. I really like astronomy and physics. I could spend hours reading, and from abstract papers, research papers, Stephen Hawking, you know, all of those. I really love learning about that.
Two other students—Marla, who responded to how she was preparing for college, and Darwin, responding to what his career at age 30 might be—appeared to have what might be considered unrealistic goals. Their responses reflect ideas that may have formed without appropriate consideration of timing before graduation or prior experiences that would shed light on what a STEM professional’s workday entails:
Marla: I want to play college sports … I was thinking for my senior year in high school, I would try to do some sports to see which ones I’m really interested in and try to get a scholarship from them.
Darwin: The plan is to join the Navy, and after joining the Navy to finish my degree or start my degree in a business course and also in marine biology. … I see myself maybe seven in the morning getting up, going and boat out to one of our research places, doing a little research, diving to check on some of our sharks that we have in the research lab. And then coming home, stopping by my house, showering up and heading out to prepare for the nightclub that I will own in the future.
While Marla and Darwin’s ambitions are admirable, Marla’s expectation of gaining an athletic scholarship without years of training and Darwin’s plan to be a marine biologist and own a nightclub by age 30 highlights a need for practitioners in the career preparation space to offer students more information about the requirements for both postsecondary access and particular careers.
Indeed, participants’ responses to questions about their plans corresponded with the experiences they shared about how school, family, and peers might be supporting (or not supporting) their educational goals and career interests. The ways that each of these factors potentially influenced students’ goals are illustrated next.
3.3.2. Social Supports
Renee and Nivea, who had very clear plans, attended a selective high school that offered pathways of study in STEM. Describing opportunities she had that are helping her prepare, Renee explained, “I’ve done multiple internships and I have one right now at John [sic] Hopkins where I studied greenhouse gas emissions and I’m comparing them to Baltimore to see what Baltimore could do better to lower their greenhouse gas emissions”. When asked why she applied to the BOAST program, Nivea stated:
Nivea: It was actually one of my teachers recommended me to join. It was my engineering teacher. And also I’m just really interested in engineering. And I heard that BOAST had algebra and engineering combined. So that’s also why I wanted to do it, and I thought that it would help me with my algebra, which it actually does.
Nivea also shared ways her school was connecting her with experiences that were connected to her interests and goals:
Nivea: We’ve actually done some things in school where we actually choose our major or have some ideas for what we want to do when we’re older. … I’ve been trying to just try to join as many programs as I can, especially STEM related programs. … I’m in engineering and this is my third year in engineering. I’m also in BOAST, obviously. I’m trying to do [an engineering internship] in the summer, which is a Johns Hopkins program. So that’s probably what might help me decide what I want to do.
Other participants attended schools where such concerted efforts did not appear to occur. For instance, Marla, who was waiting until senior year to think about sports participation that would lead to a scholarship, was asked if she had any conversations with adults in her school about postsecondary options. She responded, “Nope. Not that I know of”. Darwin, whose intentions to be both a marine biologist and a club owner, described a situation that appeared to reflect haphazard support:
Darwin: I’ve not really heard much about STEM, so I never really thought of entering any field in STEM … I currently don’t have any science classes or engineering classes… I’ve never took engineering classes and right now, they just put me on some courses to get my schedule filled. I haven’t really had much say in it.
Some participants, particularly those with uncertain or nascent ideas about a desired career, also shared frustrating educational experiences. For example, Maliah described an interest in nursing, saying, “My goal is to become a traveling nurse. … But I always wanted to travel, so it’s like me being a traveling nurse, I can go experience stuff and still do what I want”. Yet, Maliah also described recent disappointments in her math class:
Maliah: I used to enjoy math, but once COVID started, I guess, me being at home for three years … I guess that chunk away from school really knocked me off of really being a good student in math … When I went back in person this year, it was a big struggle for me to get adjusted back to a math class, actually any of my classes. And once we got to school, we didn’t really have teachers. We still don’t. And then our math teacher is actually gone … So I’m just in a math class sitting there every day … We have subs there, but they’re different every day and they just keep telling us to get on something called Imagine Math but that really doesn’t help me. And because I don’t have a teacher, I can’t ask questions the way I want to. I’m not really feeling math anymore.
This vignette from Maliah emphasizes how negative school experiences, not to mention COVID-related school closures, can potentially derail interest in particular subjects. To succeed in pursuing a nursing career, this student will need to maintain subject matter self-efficacy, and this example suggests that self-efficacy and interest in math (i.e., “feeling” it) are interdependent.
Concerning how family members informed students’ interests and goals, it is notable that Renee couched her goal of obtaining a bachelor’s degree as being “like my sister has before”. Other participants also relayed how their families and others encouraged them. Jean-Paul, who expressed a goal of becoming a computer engineer but with emerging doubts, said that his brother was supportive. Yet, the lack of specific ways that his brother would help mirrored the hesitancy of his goals:
Jean-Paul: I told my brother about what I wanted to pursue. He just said he would help me get it and all that. He would just be there to help me get it and he would just get me the program that I needed and then get me the things I need to get it.
Jean-Paul also shared that his friends had similar interests and goals, but his emphasis on “trying to do online things” and lack of resources potentially resonate with his prior expression of inadequacies to achieve his goal. He shared, “Most of [my friends] want to be an engineer as well. I talk to them about engineering. We go over some things about it. We try to do online things. We try to do NFTs and stuff, but we just don’t have the resources for that”.
Two male participants, Richie and Jonas, could be categorized as having nascent plans. For instance, Richie’s goal was to be a lawyer or investment banker. When Richie was asked how he and his friends talked about plans after high school, he stated, “I just don’t talk to them about the future … Most them not trying to go to college anyway”. Concerning his mother’s support for his plans, he shared, “My mom’s kind of really religious, and she says all lawyers are heartless, soulless. They sell their soul. And she was freaked out when I said I wanted be lawyer so switched over to investment banking and I learned about it, and it’s okay”. Richie’s explanation of his change in career plans points to the key influence of parents; Richie also described his goals as a contrast to those of his peers, as though they need protection from negative influences.
In describing his postsecondary planning, Jonas, attending the same school as Richie, stated, “I would really love to go to college. Same time, I would love to start doing gigs and promoting what I do after school”. Following up, he explained that outside of school, he did video editing. When asked how he felt about taking math coursework in college, he shared, “Math is just like a brain stimulant. I love it”. But later, when responding to a question about his experiences in high school math class, he said, “Math classes are usually very boring. And it’s as if I’m being stilled with the learning … I usually do really well in math, but when I’m feeling like the class is really slow, my assignments or the grades would go down”. Jonas’ comment indicates a strong connection between competency and interest, and his impressions may reflect varying experiences of engaging in math instruction. Sentiments such as his suggest that self-efficacy and bourgeoning interests in STEM subjects may be precarious for minoritized and low-income students. When the researcher asked Jonas if he’d had the opportunity to talk to anyone at the school about what he might do after high school, he replied:
Jonas: No. They said that we could reach out to them. They’ve talked to students as a whole group … about things and plans we can do after high school and then college. But the message altogether, I don’t feel like it’s hitting 80% of the classes, especially since nobody really cares. They [students] don’t really care for their futures. They’re okay with being on the streets, selling drugs and all that. Or just working at McDonald’s. They don’t really care for future problems or any of that.
Jonas’ response illustrates how a lack of deliberate postsecondary guidance, in combination with negative peer influences and unengaging classes, may be especially detrimental to productive career ideation among this population of high school students.