Interviewer: Peace Be upon You, Brother Hadi! Guest: May the Peace and Blessings of Allah Be upon You, Brother! Interviewer: How are you? I hope you are fine. Guest: Thank you so much. I am quite alright, thanks to Almighty Allah. Interviewer: I would just like to give you a brief idea about the research; this won’t take much time. I know the circumstances you are going through. I want to introduce myself and my research topic to you. I am Aman Al Masri, a Syrian national. My mother is from Homs. I have lost so many cousins, that last of whom was Monther Al-Hashemi; however, we thank Almighty Allah for hardships just as we thank Him for the blessings. Brother Hadi, the research I am working on is concerned with the role of social networks - the most popular of which are Facebook, Twitter, and YouTube – as well as the role of civil journalists or reporters, like you. That is the main subject of the research. Guest: I see. Interviewer: In the light of the research subject, at the present time I am making some interviews. I have also made surveys for Americans and Arab colonies following up the news, inquiring about the role you play. For legal purposes, would you please give me permission to publish all or part of this interview that is being recorded? Guest: Certainly! No problem with that. Even if you want to record a video for some parts, you can do that, God-willing. Interviewer: Great. The first question, Brother Hadi is: When did you begin using these sites, Facebook, Twitter, or other similar websites? Guest: As for such sites, when we first began working, we had no idea what the term revolution means. It is the first time a revolution of such kind breaks out; it is the first time we are exposed to such situation. On the first few days of the revolution, we did not care about filming, and we did not realize the importance of filming; we only concerned with communicating the news. In this respect, I am speaking about myself and the majority of guys. We cared for communicating the news. Initially, I was concerned with communicating with channels; since communicating with Al-Jazeera and Al Arabiya channels was extremely difficult, we used to reach out to pro-revolution channels, which were: Orbit, Safa, and Wesal. These were the channels that supported the revolution, and with which we could communicate. I got an international Lebanese roaming mobile line, and I started calling them, providing them with news immediately upon their occurrence. That was for the first phase and, thus, we cared about communicating the news much more than caring for uploading videos. Actually, uploading videos on YouTube came in later phases, may be in the second of third month after the break-out of revolution. Then, I began working on video-uploading. Certainly, neither uploading videos, nor the entire mass media were my specialties. The guys who were with me were in charge of this mission, while I was working in a field hospital, since relief work was so poor; I had to work hard in the field hospital, and also work hard as a demonstrator. Over the second and third months of the revolution, we, as a team, began uploading videos on YouTube. Then, things developed as we built 3 pages, which were as follows: a page on the news of revolution in Homs, minute by minute; Homs Revolutionists Gathering; and Homs Free-Men’s Gathering. I was one of the founders of Homs Free-Men’s Gathering that is considered part of the Syrian Revolution General Commission (SRGC). We built those three pages, which greatly helped us communicate with each other. Surely, these public pages became popular; each of them had at least 50 thousand fans. How we communicated with each other? Skype did us a big favor. But before using Skype, and over the first few days of the revolution, when communicating news, we used symbols in our speech while speaking over secret phones. For instance, if we made a demonstration in Dablan Street, one of the guys tells us: “We ate ice cream in Dablan Street.” Thus, we understood that there was a demonstration. We were using symbolic speech to avoid being chased by security forces, and because, at that time, we did not have international roaming lines. We were not experienced in using Skype, or other chatting programs; so sometimes, we were communicating through the internet, but for emergencies we were communicating by the same Syrian lines, using symbolic speech. Thanks to Almighty Allah, it was a success! Interviewer: Perfect. But did you have any difficulties using such sites? Who taught you how to use them? Guest: Personally, I had no idea how to upload videos, and just like other guys, I had limited knowledge of how to use Facebook; I dealt with it as a means of communication. Even Skype, we did not initially need it, as we used Hotmail and Gmail. Then, we began using Skype which significantly aided us. I deem Skype as a major contributor to the revolution much more than Facebook; that’s owing to the fact that Skype is not hacked by the Syrian regime. Even if the internet service is Syrian, Skype is not hacked by the Syrian regime which strenuously attempted to hack that program; yet, its attempts did not succeed. Therefore, I consider Skype a very important contributor, since we could comfortably chat as if we are spending a usual soiree, talking face to face. That’s how Skype offered us a more comfortable means of chatting, compared to Facebook, Hotmail, Gmail, and other similar sites. When Skype was available at every district or region in Homs, and as we formed a team, we began distributing work among us. First, from every district or region, there is a person who is responsible for reporting and spreading news. The same person selects another one, experienced in taking photos and videos, to be in charge of photographing. At the beginning, we used mobile phones for photography and video recording. There were almost no, or very few, cameras. Thus, we used mobile phones for video recording and taking photos, and then we uploaded to the internet. You may notice that the quality of videos and photos of the early phase of revolution was poor. In every district or region in Homs, there was a team responsible for communicating news minute by minute. There were rooms on Skype and others on Facebook, recording every single incident. For example, if a bullet was shot, we say: a bullet was shot from a certain area, and it comes out in well-organized news. Homs was so remarkable in the mass media thanks to having excellent teams. Mostly, and over the subsequent phases in particular, we never slept when there was a huge pressure on Homs, and during Baba Amr events. I can remember that I used to sleep for only 3 hours a day! This lasted for months later. We had an amazing team that made Homs so special. On the contrary, there were massacres and crimes committed in Deir az-Zour, for example, and no one cared! Up to this very moment, whenever something happens in Homs, we urge the media to pay attention to it. I feel deeply sorry for some regions that witness horrifying events, while nobody knows about them. The reason for that is the excellence of our dedicated team. All the initial founders, 90% of whom are young men I work with, made a promise to themselves, since the start and founding of this work, not to assume any positions after success of the revolution. That’s because we are not seeking after positions. This greatly helped us, as we are only concerned with spreading our word. We made a vow to ourselves, not to follow any political trend, not to get affected by any political or religious trend, not to be influenced by anybody. We only want to say what the people are willing to say. If the people said they want it to be an Islamic country, we would say the same. Whatever the people would say, we would say the same. The most important point is that we do not belong to any political or religious trends, and not to be politically or religiously affected by any one. We will not respond to being pressured by anybody to say something other than what people say. Additionally, we undertook, and we are still committed to our undertaking, to remind each other that we are not position-seekers. Each one of us will return to his normal course of life. Those who are in the university will get back to their universities; the ones who have shops will resume opening their shops, and so on. This has also enhanced our confidence that we are working for the benefit of the country. The kind of work we are performing is not for positions or future aims; it is merely for the sake of this country. We have sacrificed so many martyrs, including some of the dearest friends; photographers who were killed. Later on, I will talk about that in detail. But that was a general idea. Interviewer: Okay, and that is clear, Brother Hadi. I always follow up your posts in an attempt to find out if you have certain directions and to examine if you are subject to foreign influences, analyzing if there are any trends affecting you as activists. However, I discovered that you are not influenced by anyone or any authority, whether the National Council or a foreign agenda. That is my own testimony, as I visited your page and went through your postings and I found them objective, depicting nothing but the truth. I would like to personally greet you for this. Guest: Thank you so much. That’s a vow we have made. Perhaps you have watched the last video the guys uploaded today; it is “An Interview with Tomorrow’s Syria”, in which I spoke about the National Council. I wanted to reflect the reality; the National Council invited me almost 10 days ago, strongly urging me to leave to Turkey to contribute to establishing a transitional government, and etc. I expressed my immediate refusal of this request. Interviewer: Well…Yes; your message is clear. May Allah bless your endeavors! Now, the question is: When do you usually use such sites, whether YouTube or Facebook? In other words, do you use them during the occurrence of an incident, like for example an attack or bombing? Or do you use them after an incident to publish the names of martyrs, May Allah rest their souls, or to list the damages? Or, instead, do you use them to ask for help, such as indicating – for instance, that there are victims under debris, and etc.? How do you use these sites? Guest: Well…At the present time, Khaled Abu-Salah is in Turkey, and all media men are outside Homs. Therefore, most of the media reports on Homs are my own responsibility. There are approximately 24 districts and regions exposed to bombing daily; I use Facebook, Skype, or the internet in general almost 24 hours a day. I do not even have fixed sleeping or waking hours. At the time being, conditions are somehow stable in Homs; or, in other words, Homs is subjected to a regular bombing pace, and the number of martyrs is the same. Therefore, now I use the satellite internet for almost 16 to `17 hours a day. Recently, the guys got a Lebanese internet service; in a way or another I used a Lebanese internet service, since Homs is near Lebanon. I work using these two ways, but I find great difficulty with the internet; unfortunately, no one resolved this so far. I hope to know… (Communication was lost) Guest: May the Peace and Blessings of Allah Be upon You! The connection was lost. Interviewer: May the Peace and Blessings of Allah Be upon You, Brother! Would you like to introduce the problem you are facing, while nobody helped you so far? Guest: The internet in Syria, particularly Homs, represents a problem. No activist is satisfied with the internet service. I would like to clarify that the Unites States of America stated that it provided the Syrian activists with communication devices costing about 25 million dollars; yet, we didn’t see any of these in reality. Either the USA is merely issuing statements, or the devices were stolen by any authority. Therefore, my message is that neither America, nor any other official or non-official authority provided us with anything; even the satellite internet device was sent to me by an expatriate young man, who is also charging its credit. Thus, no official or unofficial entity gave us anything; so, at least, they can help by providing us with communication devices. The regime had suspended our internet service, and even suspended our mobile phone service. The internet constitutes a major problem for us because no one helped in this respect. Besides, the TV channels pressured me to be available for audio and video broadcast, which requires a strong internet connection. That’s why we find great difficulty in this regard, as neither the channels are flexible and accept only audio broadcast, for instance, nor is the internet service good. For example, when a rebel took place in jail in Homs, we expected a massacre there, after the Shabiha groups surrounded the jail, and the prisoners’ being threatened by the jail manager. There were many symptoms indicating that a massacre was going to take place. We used the social networks to warn against an eminent massacre or a serious incident. The same thing goes with Al-Houla massacre; there were extensive bombings. Besides, there were attempts to break in the jail by Shabiha elements. I called the international overseers and told them that a massacre was about to afflict Al- Houla. Please help us, they will break in! However, no one responded, and the fears became a reality. We warned against it at the very beginning, using social networks. The second point is that, we use social networks, Facebook, Skype, Twitter, or YouTube during the incident. In other words, sometimes bombing, funerals, or clashes are lively broadcast. For instance, during the bombing, we post news about it, describing where it happened. But some other times few guys are taking videos during incidents; thus, they upload their videos to social networks when the incident is over. Interviewer: Well...Brother Hadi, could you broadcast what you wanted to spectators and the whole world through using those sites? Guest: I think that what we managed to broadcast was only part of the event, since the Syrian event has so many secret sides and areas that are unreachable. For instance, the barriers; when I go to take a photo or video for the Syrian army barrier, this means an ultimate suicide attempt. When doing so, the snipers may see me and I can be dead by only one bullet shot! This happened to so many friends of mine. Therefore, it is impossible to broadcast all what is happening on the Syrian lands, not even to refer to it only by news. Some massacres were discovered only after a two-month period. Nonetheless, we can broadcast most of the news to a certain category of people, those who use social networks. On a daily basis, I have about twenty to twenty-four regions and in each region I record three to four videos. Therefore, it is impossible to broadcast all such events. Even the Syrian revolution channels (Syria Alshaab or Orient), or other pro-Syrian revolution channels will not broadcast all the events-related materials which are available on the internet. I have conveyed my message to part of the world, that is represented by social-networks’ followers, and those who are fans of Facebook, YouTube, or Twitter. In addition to that, the Syrian revolution channels, such as Orient, Syria Alshaab, Syria Tomorrow, Wesal, and Safa, helped local people know what is going on in other governorates; those channels broadcast most of – not all - the videos and news we propagate. Yet, the negative aspect of these channels is that they only target the Syrians; people in Saudi Arabia and America– for example – do not watch them. However, their positive side lies in broadcasting the majority of videos and news. Interviewer: My next question is: Can you specify the most significant thing you presented through such social networks; something you felt that it has helped? Guest: I can’t specify. But the most important of them are YouTube, Facebook, Twitter, or Skype, we which we consider correlated in one chain. If we missed one of them, there will be a huge disorder. For instance, when I record a video, how can I publish its link without Facebook? The opposite is if we lost YouTube; when I post news on YouTube and Europeans watch it, they may believe it or not; they are right in this regard, since they know nothing about the events in Syria. I can’t tell which of those social networks, whether YouTube or other, was the major contributor; yet, I can say that Skype greatly served us on the first days of the revolution, because it was not spotted by the regime. As it wasn’t hacked by the regime, it could help us. Interviewer: In the light of the same question, did you feel that there is a particular event you posted on these networks which benefited the Syrian revolution? Is there a certain incident, massacre, or bombing you posted on Facebook, and which was internationally populated, resulting in casting pressure on the regime? Guest: Yes, Al-Houla massacre. But Daria and Qubair massacres were catastrophic, compared to Al-Houla, because the number of victims was the double. Several massacres took place in Syria, but the international community didn’t move a muscle with regard to a massacre like Al-Houla, which constituted a very significant point in the Syrian revolution. What helped us propagate that massacre was the great work performed by the guys who gathered all corpses and got a video for them. Then, they divided the corpses into three groups, one for children, another for women, and the third for men, taking an overall scenery for that. Otherwise, and if there were no videos supporting the news, no one would have believed that Al_Houla was the most barbarous and the most brutal massacre. Therefore, recording videos for the dead bodies of children and Al-Houla martyrs, and uploading them to YouTube was the major and biggest event in the Syrian revolution. There are also so many important and influential events, including Karam Al-Zaytoun events were the first days on which children and women were slaughtered by knives; videos for this incident were broadcast on YouTube. Interviewer: Brother, I would move to another topic; we all know that activists and oppositionists of the regime use social networks. There are studies and researchers saying that, just as the social networks served you, they also did for the Syrian regime which uses the same networks for anti-propaganda and deception. Besides, the Syrian regime uses it to overthrow and arrest you, and to know the locations of the free Syrian army. What do you think? Guest: At the beginning, I would like to clarify a very important issue. Please take into consideration that the Syrian regime has so many satellite channels, and can comfortably and easily use a very good internet connection; it has qualified and well-educated media staff; it has satellite channels broadcast 24 hours a day; examples of these channels are the Syrian TV, Al Dounia TV, and other supporting channels such as Al-Manar, and the Iranian channel, Al Alam. However, the revolutionists were acknowledged as superseding the regime’s media, although we have never studied mass media, or used cameras before, or made press statements through channels before. I have noticed that there are some media spokesmen of the Syrian revolution who have become so special in documenting events. I can say that we managed to excel over the regime’s media men; we could disclose their lies and convey our message, in spite of all means of media blackout used by the regime when the internet and mobile services were suspended and when were prevented from moving between districts. All possible means were used for suppression and media blackout. However, we managed to excel over the regime. The revolution’s media-men excelled over those of the regime. The proof is that all channels and all international news agencies – rather than the Arabic ones which may be said as showing sympathy -believed the media of Syrian activists and the revolution’s media-men, rather than the regime’s media officials. As for the regime’s manipulation of the social networks, the answer is yes the regime did make use of these sites. A splinter officer told me that my phone land line and Facebook page were overseen. That officer was working in the State’s Security Authority; he told me that at least thirty reports about me were communicated. I was quite aware of this but I was trying to console myself. This means that the regime was timely following up our page and our every single act. I can give you an example demonstrating that the regime examines the videos and photos we post to the internet; i.e., we are always over-watched by the regime. Fortunately, up to this very moment no one could make us stumble, as far as the media is concerned. Thus, it is evident that the Syrian regime is over-watching us, awaiting us to err in order to humiliate us. But thanks to Almighty Allah, it will not be able to do so. Interviewer: Do you think that you are hacked as media-men? Or do you think there are secret agents among you? Guest: As media-men, no I don’t think so. But certainly there are secret agents at the revolution as a whole. There are so many people who claim that they are media-men who are working for the benefit of the revolution, but in fact they don’t. On the other hand, we are a team. It is right that I work as a spokesman of the Syrian Revolution General Commission (SRGC), but I work with all media-men, and I am in immediate touch with all of them, no matter what are their trends. I am in touch with everybody and I have good relations with them. So, we are not hacked or penetrated as media-men; liars are immediately disclosed before the media at once. For example, if one of them is at a certain district and communicated particular news, or wanted to exaggerate such news, we have so many other guys at the same district who would immediately deny the false news. Besides, it is impossible that all media-men in the region are penetrated or liars. Therefore, as media-men team, we are not hacked. I can tell you that the free army is penetrated, which means that there are people who are fighting with the revolutionists while they are the regime’s secret agents. Even demonstrations are penetrated. This is quite ordinary. But I do not think we are penetrated as media-men. Interviewer: Excellent: I have two final questions, Brother. Without the availability of Skype, YouTube, Facebook, Twitter, or other websites which are concerned with photos, like Flicker, do you think the Syrian revolution possible to begin without such sites? Guest: I confirm that without the existence of these websites, genocides were going to take place in Syria. I don’t want to say that the Syrian revolution would have been banished, but perhaps a whole governorate was going to be polished off. As you know, Hamah witnessed a massacre in the eighties when thousands of victims were killed, while no one ever knew anything about them or got a photo for such massacre. No information about them was found; we couldn’t differentiate between the lost, the killed, and the injured. Therefore, without the help of such websites, the Syrian revolution would have been aborted in its early days; yet, it wouldn’t have been aborted peacefully as genocides were going to take place. Interviewer: My last question, Brother Hadi is: do you believe that the public trust what you present through these websites? Guest: On my part, I have gained credibility. I have never exaggerated in communicating any news before. In fact, we work as a team, as per the regulations we vowed and promised; we promised ourselves not to seek after positions. In addition to the rule that we agreed on, with respect to non-belonging to any political or religious trend, and to represent the people’s voice, we also undertook that we will not jointly post news, as I have no idea what happens in another district without the guys working over there. Moreover, we made a promise to ourselves not to publish news unless we have seen it ourselves. That’s why the credibility we have gained so far is great. Consequently, I could reach out to any channel or news agency. Worth mentioning is that I am in touch with so many news agencies, especially the French News Agency, Reuters, and many others; I provide them with a daily report, particularly when a major incident takes place in Homs. For example, during Baba Amr events, Reuters, the French News Agency, as well as many other Italian and Spanish news agencies, Al-Jazeera, Al Arabiya, BBC, France, other well-known Arabic channels, and also CNN, all of them without exception used to literally state the same news I provide them with, which signifies my credibility. When I say, there are 6 martyrs, they state 6 martyrs, since they became sure that Hadi doesn’t exaggerate or lie. I would like to repeat that we have undertaken not to post news unless we have seen it ourselves. Since the present circumstances we are surviving are already tragic, so there is no reason for exaggeration! It’s already quite an extraordinary tragedy that leaves no room for exaggeration. Interviewer: You are right, Brother Hadi. To conclude this interview in points, how could you serve the revolution using these sites? Guest: First, I reported what is going on in reality to the world outside. The Syrian regime prevented any foreign mass media means from getting in Syria. There is one significant point to be referred to. Channels like BBC and France always tell us that there are two stories; one narrated by the regime and the other by you. I respond to them by saying that you must believe our story, because, from the very first day on which the revolution broke out, we asked for the admission of mass media to cover the events, while the regime prevented and is still preventing it from entering Syria. Why? That is because anyone - who prevents mass media coverage - is certainly afraid of disclosing the truth before people. On the other hand, we have no such fears. Therefore, we could convey people’s message; we could depict and broadcast people’s suffering; we could broadcast the agonies and screams of widows and orphans; we could make the whole world see the destroyed houses; we could let the entire universe hear the screams and cries of kids, and the agonies of the injured. I could convey this message in general. I could broadcast the street’s events. Thanks to Almighty Allah, I never failed in doing so. On so many days, since Baba Amr events and up to this very moment, recently when there was an attempt to break in Khaledia, I received at least 26 to 30 phone calls from different channels within 24 hours only. We could spread the voice of people who have rights and we could broadcast what people are going through on this land. Interviewer: Well…thank you so much Brother Hadi. I would like to thank you so much for your answers and for your precious time. This interview and its questions will be translated into English. Would you like to get the English translation version? Guest: No, my English language is poor. But if you wanted any clarification, or if you have any other question, please feel free to write it to me if I am not available. I will answer once I am back. Interviewer: I have one more question. What was your job before the revolution? And how old are you? Guest: I am 26 years old. Before the revolution, I was a teacher in Al-Baath University in Hamah; I was a teacher in the Faculty of Nursing, Emergency Department. Even at the beginning of the revolution, I was still practicing my teaching job. I used to come and go through the roads; barriers were not so many, and I could move from one street to another. Then, as the number of barriers increased, I left the university. Interviewer: I just wanted to ask these two questions to make things clear. You said you made a promise to yourselves to resume your ordinary course of life, that’s why I wanted to explain this to prove the transparency of the kind of work you are performing. I desired to write that those young men are working as per their believed goal. For instance, Brother Abou-Jaffar has an electronics shop; Brother Hadi Al-Abd-Allah was a teacher in the Faculty of Nursing. In other words, all what I wanted to clarify was that each of you has their own activities; all of a sudden, you stopped living the kind of life you used to live, dedicating all your activities for serving this revolution. Guest: Yes. In addition, we are appealing since months ago to be provided with quick internet service; we have large numbers of videos and audios which we want to upload. I have a satellite internet device which was good at the beginning. Yet, the connection became poor because there became large numbers of these devices in Syria, approximately 600. This has cast great pressure on such internet service, making the connection so slow. For example, while I am speaking to you only via voice, the sound becomes unclear sometimes, once good and then bad, bearing in mind that were are merely speaking via voice. Almost all our communications are audio and video; the problem lies in the internet service. Everybody promised to solve this but didn’t keep their promises. Unfortunately, they bought devices bearing my name, but neither I nor others in Syria received any such devices. Therefore, I feel too bad towards the internet issue; I just need internet for calls. I want a device that can handle audio and video communication on Skype without connection problems. Interviewer: May Allah protect you sir. You know Mr. Hadi that people do appreciate what you are doing, and we are also grateful for your exerted efforts. Guest: All what we are doing is after all for the sake of this country. Any person - speaking too much of what he is doing – is not working for the sake of Allah or this country. Interviewer: May Allah bless you, Brother! Guest: Thank you so much, Brother. Glad to talk to you. Interviewer: I am equally delighted to speak to you Brother Hadi. May the Peace of Allah Be upon You! Goodbye!